2nd Gear Fix ideas

[DGXSER]

ok, after reading all the great info on this site, I am getting psyched up to try the dremel fix. I hate the idea of having to tear that much into a bike just bought three weeks ago, but I also would hate to ruin the gears, forks, or even engine bearings by being bull headed about it.

anyway, I am looking into the best place to get the gaskets needed, any recommendations are welcome. Also, wondering if I need to remove the exhuast on the 81 special? (I noticed in the tech tip that TC had not.) Also, I have an impact driver, is there a down side to using it instead of the inserted wood?

Also debating the flipping the bike over or just running it up on car ramps and putting some blocking under the center stand or something like that, or maybe just leaning on its side as one member suggested. Seems like flipping it would make the reapair easiest, but this is one heavy bike, and if I crush anything it would really ruin my day.

Since alot of folks here have many seasons on their bikes since some of you did the dremel fix, how has it held up over time, same for the washer swap on second gear? I am definitely into saving the money for new gears, seems like they could only last as long as the repaired gears anyway.

[TopCatGr58]

Hey DGxser,

That photo guide was made a few years ago, before I had acquired my fancy shop tools, ie., air impact wrench, etc., and was trying to provide info for others that also might not have access to the fancy tools! I did the impact technique on the last couple of clutches I worked on, but you'll still need the wood wedge for retorquing it anyways!

Yes, the tranny pan can be removed without removing the OEM pipes.

Laying the bike on it's side is an okay compromise, but you have to remove the shift fork shaft from one side, and slide the 5th gear off the countershaft on the other side, and then getting the countershaft out, possibly needing to put the shift lever back on to do a dry run thru the gears before buttoning it all back up. Having shift forks as well as the countershaft falling on my face was my main reason for flipping it up. I had the old buckhorns on at the time with plans of replacing them, so I wasn't as worried about possibly bending them with the weight of the bike during the flipping, but I used some wood and such to support the frame to take the stress off the bars once flipped. Taking the front MC off, rotating the clutch lever holder, taking the mirrors off, etc. will help prevent damage to those parts.

There's a recent thread by Phase3 and others regarding the merits of the washer swap, vs. just the dremmeling/die grinding of the gears. I did both 2/5 and 1/4 gears, no washer swap, and have a little big bore stress level on the engine/tranny. I only have ~12k miles on mine since the fix, I don't ride it everday, but I don't baby it at all, have done wheelies, and many hi rpm runs in lower gears while running the twisties, etc., and nary a skip!
T.C.

[Ivan]

anyway, I am looking into the best place to get the gaskets needed, any recommendations are welcome.

They come in a tube that says something like "Ultra Silver", "Ultra Copper" or "Ultra Black"

I used the silver, since it matches the color scheme of the engine. Wouldnt want to mess up the feng sheui of Yamaha

[bikerphil]

Breaking loose the clutch nut

I just use the rear brake with the tranny in gear to loosen/tighten the clutch nut. Works like a charm every time. If you don't want to spend a small fortune, make your own gaskets with gasket sheet material from the auto parts store. A hole punch works for most of the holes.

[ccogswel]

I have done the dremel fix on my brothers bike and mine. My brother doesn't get a chance to ride his bike much being he's a truck driver. But I have been riding it around myself while working on my bike trying to get it back together and have put about 1000 miles on it this past year. Or I should say the last 2 summers now. I done the dremel fix and the washer swap. Haven't had one problem with it. It shifts great. There is no binding,grinding,shoving,popping. I can hammer the heck out of it and it takes it just fine. I can even do the mad shifter as I call it with no troubles.

If you have access to a engine lift that would be great for flipping it. But if not you can flip it with out it. A little tougher in my opinion. I read somewhere here that someone said and I can't remember who but they said they flipped it on the side as far as it would go and then put a 2x4 or something into the rear wheel to help flip it the rest of the way. They also said they put it into gear first to keep the wheel still. Which ever way you go about fixing it will be up to you. I think it would be easier to do it with the bike upside down myself. I couldn't think of doing it any other way. But I have read here about others doing it on it side and while others done it on the center stand so.....

There's a new pole idea. Which way did you do the dremel fix? Upside down, center stand, side to side, or take it to the shop. Maybe Prom or T.C. or someone could start that one up. LOL

You will be fine. It's not that bad. The tuffest part you will find or atleast it was for me is when you back cut the dogs on the gears and the slots. I spent alot of time making sure that my back cuts on the dogs and slots were the same and then checking them against each other to make sure they all hit at the same time. Even using a dial caliper to check them. I done that to every gear I could. Also just a reminder. Make sure you have it in 4th gear when you get that point. And just double check your work just to make sure you didn't miss anything. You'll be happy when you get done. If you have a good memory when you take it all apart you will be able to put it back the same way.

As for the gaskets. If you get lucky, and I mean lucky when you pull the covers off maybe none of the gaskets will tear. Then you could reuse if you wanted to. But if they do just go to a parts store like Napa or AutoZone or what ever you have around and buy a role of gasket material. You may have to buy 2 or 3 roles. Depending on how many you may have to make. Just make sure what thickness you get as I had ran into some with different thickness. Didn't know they had them like that. What I do is I try to take as much off of the old gasket with out tearing it anymore then it is and save it. Then I lay my cover on top of the gasket making material and I trace the outside of it. Then I take what is left of the old gasket and lay it on top so I can trace the inside edge. Trace all the circles and what ever else that needs to be traced then I cut it out. I use a single hole punch to make my holes with. And if I run into a hole that is bigger then my hole punch I use it to punch out around the edge of it. Looks kind of funny but if done right it will still work.

You will be fine.
Good Luck!

[DGXSER]

Had not thought of the engine hoist. That should work well and I have access to one. Should be able to keep all things intact and still get it on its back. I like the car ramp with boards on it idea, still have the original bars, they better be able to stabalize without bending.

Thanks for the encouragement and suggestion on buying gasket material. Have done that for an old boat motor before, don't know why the simple things sometimes elude me. A trip to the auto parts store, and hardware store for a T-30 Torqs. And get some oil, and hypoid for the rear drive, and find the dremel bits....

[Yahman]

I jacked my Maxim up and placed concrete blocks under the wheels, then I stabilized it with tie-downs anchored to the walls of my one car garage.

Larry

[ccogswel]

You still want to be very carefull with the handle bars. I put a old set on mine when I fliped it and still bent one.

And I forgot to mention what I used to hold it after I got it flipped. I used 2 cement blocks with a 2x4 on top. And then I put 2 car stands on each of the rear turn signal part of the frame. The bike was very stable. I also removed the signals from the side I had towards the ground when I was flipping it, just in case! You never know.

[GNEPIG]

The easiest way that I have done it so far, was to just hoist the front end of the bike straight up in the air (like popping a giant wheelie). Used an engine hoist. Didn't have to remove too much stuff and had great access to both sides and the bottom of the engine from a bar stool.
I guess you could also use a tree and some rope and pull it with your truck or car= good rope/ cable, a large healthy oak tree and good communications with the person driving the car/ truck are a must.

However you do it be careful and good luck.

[ccogswel]

Yeah I tried that way myself but I didn't like the bike moving around as mcuh as it did that way. I just didn't feel comfortable so I laid it up side down. If I could have kept it still that would have been great.

[DGXSER]

Interesting alternative as well, standing it up. Well, I checked my local autozone and they did not have the 20W40 oil, or the gasket material in a width that would cover the clutch cover or the oil pan. So I guess I need to try a NAPA or KOI.

Also, what source has been best for the dremel bits? Mail or internet order? Any local places that typically have them?

Thanks,

[TopCatGr58]

I found the Dremmel bits at my local LOWES home hardware/building supply store. I've also seen them at WALLYWORLD!

The dremmel bits are not as strong as bits for a die grinder, but not everybody has a die grinder/air compressor. I think I stated that you may need more than 1 of each size to complete the job, especially for the 1st/4th gear slots/dogs!
T.C.

[DGXSER]

Well, the project has begun. I have it down to TC's description of "this is where I flip the bike". Only took me two hours to get here. I started to pull the trans pan, but it would seem I have to pull the exhaust to get to four of the trans pan bolts. Am I missing a secret method to get to these?

Also, have not got the lift yet, so not sure if I am going to lift it, roll it side to side, flip it, or just try it on the centerstand on the ground since that is where it is at. Is it ok, safe, to leave it open like this for a week or so especially in winter? Is it ok to roll the bike a bit with it taken down this far?

I have taken auto engines down to the block and put them back together, but for some reason this thing seems like an entirely new animal to me. And a bit firghtening to some extent as SWMBO will kill me if I screw it up after just buying it. Did not get mine as cheap as some on here.

Taking a break for a bit. I hate to think of pulling those header bolts and breaking one off in the head.

[XSPastor]

Well, the project has begun. I have it down to TC's description of "this is where I flip the bike". Only took me two hours to get here. I started to pull the trans pan, but it would seem I have to pull the exhaust to get to four of the trans pan bolts. Am I missing a secret method to get to these?

Also, have not got the lift yet, so not sure if I am going to lift it, roll it side to side, flip it, or just try it on the centerstand on the ground since that is where it is at. Is it ok, safe, to leave it open like this for a week or so especially in winter? Is it ok to roll the bike a bit with it taken down this far?

I have taken auto engines down to the block and put them back together, but for some reason this thing seems like an entirely new animal to me. And a bit firghtening to some extent as SWMBO will kill me if I screw it up after just buying it. Did not get mine as cheap as some on here.

Taking a break for a bit. I hate to think of pulling those header bolts and breaking one off in the head.

1. no problem rolling the bike.
2. Just place some rags in the open cavities so dirt won't settle inside the engine.
3. Don't worry about screwing it up. Anything can be fixed. Take your time and ask here if you're unsure about proceeding with a given step.
The header nuts are not usually that tight. Actually some guys have trouble with them staying tight as they can tend to vibrate loose. Hit 'em with some PB Blaster or similar if they are stubborn. This is a stock exhaust, right?

[DGXSER]

Pastor, Thanks for the support. Freak out is over for the moment.

Yes, the exhaust is stock or at leat Yamaha replacement. Looks awfully good for the age if it is stock, but the bike has been well taken care of. The exhaust is off, and yes they came off pretty easy. Yes, I actually found no 4 nuts were loose. I am to used to auto exhaust where you are almost guaranteed to break off a stud or two on something this old. Have the "strainer" /oil pan off. Next step is oil pump. then either roll it or stand it up.

Guess if it was that easy, every body would own these cool bikes.