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**skids** · 02-22-2003, 05:57 PM

I would look into the airlocked gas tank possibility. I have had my bike quit like that when the battery quit taking a charge. You know, the black box needs something like 10.2 volts to operate. When the battery craps out, it can be a difficult thing to diagnose.

**Buddhas Ghost** · 02-22-2003, 06:09 PM

Air locked gas tank?

You lost me there.

If it were a bad battery why would it run fine again for 10 miles after the engine cooled down? Curious.

**Bill** · 02-22-2003, 06:37 PM

Re: Tid14-01 Ignition Unit

Buddhas Ghost wrote:

I see the old XS11 board seems to be gone.

Well, not really. There's still a persistant group of XSives on YahooGroups at:

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/allxs11s/

On a cross country trip it broke down on me in Wyoming and I bought a truck and drove home to Washington state where it has sat ever since. The problem is it will run for about ten miles on the freeway and then lose all spark to all 4 plugs.

Very often, the most mysterious problems boil down to simple fixes. When you say you "lose spark in all 4 plugs", have you checked them individually when the bike quits, or just checked the pipes? If you haven't actually checked spark at the spark plugs or connectors, that would be a good first step in troubleshooting.

As Skids said, it could be a vapor lock. That could happen without an ignition failure. If the fuel cap vent is plugged, a negative pressure (vaccuum) develops in the tank and fuel won't drain. It's easy to check... when it quits, just leave open the fuel cap and try to restart it. If it starts up, you're golden.

In my experience, it usually isn't the black box. However, a few XSives have reported success from re-soldering some bad solder joints inside the box.

The most common ignition failure is caused by faulty pick up coil wires. See The Coil Pickup Fix. A quick check for this one is to disconect and plug the vacuum line to the coil pickup unit. That keeps the unit from rotating with throttle changes. If it still quits after 10 miles, that wasn't it.

The spark plug wires can be heat- and vibration-sensitive. There's a lot of troubleshooting information available in the tech tips. See New Wires in Old Coils.

If these checks don't work, let me know. I think I know where to find a TID 14-01 ('81 Special?) black box.

**Buddhas Ghost** · 02-22-2003, 11:31 PM

Good info there.

Unfortunately I did check all the plugs and spark was gone from all four. I'm going to do some more testing tomorrow. thanks for the feedback.

**wildbill** · 02-26-2003, 05:56 PM

engine trouble

The bike I own 78 XS11 got real bad gas mileage and then finally quit all together. I have checked coilwires.When it quit last I rode less than a mile. The hot wire going to starter got so hot it was smoking. The lights would not work until about 30 min. later. Have any ideas? Thanks

**Buddhas Ghost** · 02-26-2003, 08:36 PM

Was your starter engaging at this time? Sounds like some short to ground in your starter motor.

**uk1.1s** · 02-27-2003, 08:50 AM

Hot bike - no sparks

Only time I've heard of this sort of problem is related to a coil breaking down. Sometimes a coil will develop a fault after it's had time to get up to operating temperature. Only problem is - if you have NO spark, BOTH coils have got the same fault simultaneously. Possible - not probable.

As said in another response above - the symptom sounds like vacuum lock in the tank due to a blocked vent in the tank filler cap. BUT if you're sure there's definitely no spark (rather than no fuel) then maybe that ones ruled out.

OK so far I'm getting no where

- but trying to think it through logically.

Last potential cause is a loose wire in the ignition system that detaches itself after a while (although why it re-attaches after the bike cools down.... Well, can't do no harm checking all the wiring in the ignition system I suppose.

If it was me I'd do a bit of testing, to rule out the unlikely reasons for the problem outlined above.

1. Run the bike (close to home) until it dies again. Open the fuel filler cap and then try to start her again with the cap open. If that works you have got a tank vacuum caused by the tiny vent hole being blocked in the filler cap. Cure is simply to clean out the hole with a piece of wire or something. You could of course clean out the vent hole BEFORE you take it for that first ride ....but there's always the chance of not knowing if you've fixed it until you break down (or not) again. Sods Law says it'll probably do 50 miles before another breakdown and leave you high and dry somewhere.

2. Try to borrow some suitable coils (in known good condition). Install them and run the bike for the required 10 miles... hopefully more.

Good luck - I'm sure someone on the forum can do a better diagnosis job than me here

**wildbill** · 02-27-2003, 10:25 PM

bad running or not xs

I don`t have my bike where I can check it easy(in shop) claim they can`t fix it. I`ll go later this week or next and bring it home and see what I can do. Will keep you informed. Thanks.

**Buddhas Ghost** · 02-27-2003, 10:47 PM

I started the bike this past Sunday and let it run idling for 45 minutes. It didn't die at all. This changes things greatly. It dies and loses spark when run at freeway speeds, but not at idle. I'm going to check out the advance this weekend if I get a chance.

**Red Baron** · 03-16-2003, 07:47 AM

Original Statement

Back to your original statement, i had the same problem. I work about 5 miles from home, i start the bike and head for work, the bike quits and will not run and plugs not firing. thought i had a bad ignitor unit, took to work to check. By the way i sell Honda and Yamaha bikes for a living, the guys said there was no real way to check this unit, i was very disappointed. However not to be swayed from my quest to ride again, i used the following routine to check the components;
1. start and run bike until it quits. if possible.
2. check continuity with an ohm meter at the six pin plug behind the fuse box, flasher, etc on right hand side of bike. The plug is square with six connectors, 2 rows of three. The 2 on each end should read infinite or closed circuit, the one wire in the center is a ground and should read infinite when tested to the frame. If this is correct proceed to next step. If not read, the article here on "PICKUP WIRE FIX" and repair accordingly.
3. Check the voltage across the battery with the engine running, i had only 12.23 volts returning to battery, not enough to operate properly. i then cleaned all the connections in this circuit and upped the voltage to 13.63 at idle.
Also check the stator, turn on the key and the housing should act like a magnet, use a screwdriver, feeler gauge, etc., pull should be steady but not wrist slapping strong. This indicates the stator is functioning properly, and should be putting out current, if not the rectifier is bad, aftermarkets are available for around $75.00.
4. check and clean all connections between the start and end of these two circuits, several connections are located here, how many depends on your bike and how close to stock it is. A quick and dirty cleaning process is to spray with Wd 40 and disconnect and reconnect the plugs a few times, this isn't a fix just a way to quickly clean the connections. i found, after this process, that my problem disappeared. i then recleaned all connections and sealed the open ends with silicone caulk to waterproof them. i checked each wire from plug to plug with an ohm meter found a bad connection at a jumper plug, corroded, causing heating and loss of contact. Bike has operated for a full month now, charges and performs better than it has in years. i forget how old this bike is sometimes. i was at my wits end and had decided to start replacing parts. what i had forgotten is that a little patience goes a long way.
5. It is highly unlikely that any of these parts are bad, it is more likely that you have a bad connection or loose or broken wire, there are only 2 circuits responsible for the main operation of the bike, charging and ignition. the wiring system is not complicated on this bike, by the way the ignitor pack is no longer available from yamaha, last posted retail price from our dealership was $600.00. Also open this and check for rust at the connector end of the circuit board, six screws on front and cover comes off. check for continuity at the plug by testing from the plug in leads to their soldered counterpart, bottom plug rear solder union, etc., if rust is present here, it will be a light coat on the solder joints and circuit board, carefully clean this off with a stiff bristle brush, not a wire brush, it will cause shorting from circuit to circuit if rust is present.
6. i cleaned mine in this manner and my problems went away, hope this helps.
If you have repaired your problem and this was not the culprit please post your fix on this board for the rest of us. Best of luck, i hope this helps.

**Red Baron** · 03-16-2003, 07:51 AM

Ignitor unit

It is possible that Willie's in Camp Hill, Al may have one if you do need it. 1-800-334-4045. He buys a lot of wrecked bikes from the area, and has a great selection of XS bikes. he is very knowledgeable and helpful. It is my experience that the ignitor unit is hard to find and impossible to purchase new.

**Buddhas Ghost** · 03-16-2003, 01:01 PM

I need to find the time to go buy a battery, as mine is shot from sitting too long. Then I'll do some more testing.

**wildbill** · 03-16-2003, 10:20 PM

shorts on xs

I took your advice with a ohm meter and checked wires running to pickup coils. I think the wires are broken or burned into.Could not get a reading will check again tomorrow. Thanks Red Baron

**wildbill** · 03-18-2003, 03:06 PM

ign. unit,pulse coils.

I checked out my wires today,cleaned conections and then checked continunity with multimeter.I get the right reading on center bottom plug but none of the others register anything.The ign.unit should show something but does not.This is getting over my head.Who could check these things out for me or give me some hints or ideas?Could someone who works on electrical parts help in this?If not I may have to part the bike out.Don`t want to,want to ride. Thanks

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Tid14-01 Ignition Unit

Tid14-01 Ignition Unit

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