Kick start removal.

[79XS11F]

I'm installing a performance clutch in my hop-up engine today and as part of this job will be removing the kick starters internal parts. A search for "kick starter removal" took me no where so the question is ... is there any reason to not also remove the kick starter engagement assembly? (Clymer manual, page 105, photo 170 & 171)
Rob

[79XS11F]

Well .. that's a no go. There is 1 bolt inside the cases that secures that internal shaft in place. So even if the internal parts are not needed they will be staying put.
Rob

[DiverRay]

Rob,
Did you look at the later bikes to see what they had for internals? I don't think YAMAHA would pay for the parts just to keep a bolt in place! Just A Thought...

[trbig]

I took all the guts out of mine. I had polished up the case that had the kick shaft coming out of it. It was such a chore to get done that I didn't want to do it again... so I just left out the gears and stuff and left the outer spring and shaft that sit under the clutch cover. The shaft exits the cover to keep the water out and the oil in, but it doesn't do anything. I tried to remove a plug from a spare clutch cover I had and swap it, but gave up since it wouldn't budge.

It's been a long time since I removed it and I don't remember what was involved, but it seems there was a gear just under the cover that had to be removed as well.


Tod

[79XS11F]

DiverRay
I can't find a clear enough fiche to see what's inside on the later models. i just put the clutch back in but have not torqued the center nut yet because it looks like I can access that inside bolt if I remove the oil pan. The engine is not in the bike and I have a pan gasket if needed.
So the question remains .. is there anything I have over looked that would indicate that the internal kick starter engagement assembly should not be removed?

TR
I bough a plug to replace the seal where the original kick start shaft comes through the engine clutch cover. Bike bandit still sells them. By the looks of things in my manual those parts are not needed but I may be over looking something because my manual shows those parts with the cases already split.

Rob

[79XS11F]

I have been looking real close at the Clymer manual and based on the photo numbered 191 on page 112 that internal gear only interacts with the trany. It just spins with the trany unless the kicker is in use. The manual says to split the cases to gain access to the internal assembly but clearly in photo 112 that bolt is fully exposed when the oil pan is off.
So unless the assembly can't get by the trany there should be no need to split the cases? In the removal description there is nothing about removing any trany parts before removing the internal kick start parts? I will also hazard to guess that if the trany is in the way the shaft that would create the issue is the one we already remove to do repairs without splitting the cases?
A new question of course will be ... can the gear on the trany shaft that is driven by the kick start internal gear also be deleted?
Rob

[79XS11F]

Well it looks like the trany shaft will have to be dropped to get those other internal kick starter engagement parts out. There just isn't enough clearance in there so I will do that today. The gear on the trany shaft is also not deletable. I hope the re & re of the trany shaft is as easy as the instructions make it appear to be
Rob

[79XS11F]

I decided not to get into dropping the trany and figured if I cut the shaft support off at the inside side I would be able to wiggle that internal gear out. That was a no go so I ended up cutting 3 teeth off that internal gear so it would slide out through the clutch side casing hole. Covered everything with a oiled shop rage and did it in 15 min. I could have saved an hour if I had just cut off the three teeth right from the get go. Internal and external kick start parts are now gone.


Rob

[mro]

as part of this job will be removing the kick starters internal parts

OK...I'll bite, why remove em?

Bike going on a diet?


mro

[79XS11F]

Originally posted by mro

OK...I'll bite, why remove em?

Bike going on a diet?


mro

It's just un-necessary moving parts. So far as weight goes .. I would guess that the whole setup for the kick starter is only about 2 pounds, so not a "diet" thing even if every pound counts.
I didn't see any sense in leaving the internal parts in place if the external parts were removed.
Rob

[somesuch]

And finally now we will have the exact steps on what to do when _adding_ a kickstart to a bike _without_ splitting the cases

--Nick

[79XS11F]

no ... this was a PERMANENT removal. Even if I had not cut the support lug out of the cases the internal gear needed to have 3 teeth cut off it.
If the internal parts of the kick starter assembly have been removed and you want to put them back you would have to get the counter shaft out so the internal gear of the kick start system can be properly placed. The cases would however not have to be split as is seen when doing a removal of that shaft for gear repairs.
Rob

[jwoell]

I'm stoked about this. I've been hoping a kickstarter could be added without splitting the cases, so thanks for all the info in this thread. I'll have to dig into my engine and see how difficult it is to remove that transmission shaft. Ohh well, I probably needed to clean out the oil pan anyway. Thanks for the info.

Still not sure why you'd want to remove a kickstarter though, but oh well.

[79XS11F]

I am removing it because it is unnecessary. That's why Yamaha removed it as well.
If my starter fails I would have better results push starting over the kicker.
Have you every kicked over one of there puppies? If compression is within spec it is no easy task and will only work if the issue is strictly a starter failure. You will not start this bike if the issue is electoral in nature or a weak battery.
Would you want a hand crank on the front of your car engine?
Rob