1st and 2nd gear

[clint]

my 1st gear is trashed and i am going to replace the trans and clutch any one have any advice on clutches and do many people have probs with gears?

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Clint,

It's amazing what you can find when you look thru
the tech tips.....ie., repairs, tranny section !!

Then also check out the MODS section, engine, for clutch repairs tips!

You don't have to replace your tranny, just fix the faulty parts!
T.C.

[BlkMage]

TC is right, as usual.

I'm actually going to replace my 1st gear and do the 2nd gear fix this winter with a box of gears I got from eBay. That section has every bit of info you would EVER need. I especially liked the page detailing the different configurations in different gears (helped my realize what was wrong with 1st).

And after pulling the engine and tranny for the first time, I'm glad I found the part about pulling the clutch and shift mechanism to pull the gears out. Trust me, fix is easier than replace.

[Jerry]

Clutch repairs...

Over the years a consensus has evolved. Stick with Yamaha's OEM friction plates, but make sure all the pressure plates are flat. Barnett springs are frequently used to replace stockers that have lost some of their tension. However, the Barnett springs generally give less latitute in slippage, are more go/no go than stockers. Many like the very positive feel these springs give to the clutch.

A few folks have added 1 friction and pressure plate, but these seems to be a cure more for worn springs than an actual upgrade. Some have reported problems with a dragging clutch after adding the extra parts, some have had good results. I suggest looking into new friction plates and springs before going this route unless you are on a really tight budget.

Make sure you check out the clutch adjustment Tech Tip and that your clutch cable is not binding in any way. Given the age of these bikes a new clutch cable isn't a bad idea. Take a look at the other Tech Tips that deal with clutch issues...there is a lot of good info in these links! Link to tech Tips is http://www.xs11.com/tips/maintenance/index.shtml and look under Engine.

[GNEPIG]

Just in case all of this doesn't look complicated enough, here is another link/thread to read.

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...r&pagenumber=1 Transmission gear spacing

After repairing the transmissions on 6 of these bikes, by only undercutting the trans gears, Two of them have come back rather fast with the first gears slipping again. After scratching my head about it for a while and asking questions to a bunch of people that don't know jack ****, finally a user here (ag9123) made a sugestion that made sense.
I have heard on here that this Trans adjustment is crap, but Yamaha seem to think that it was important enough to make it a Service Bulletin long before I thought about it and posted it here.
Under cutting the gears is a great improvment, but not always the complete fix(and also sounds nessesary in your case Clint).
Anyway, I hope this helps.

[GNEPIG]

Quote:
A few folks have added 1 friction and pressure plate, but these seems to be a cure more for worn springs than an actual upgrade. Some have reported problems with a dragging clutch after adding the extra parts, some have had good results. I suggest looking into new friction plates and springs before going this route unless you are on a really tight budget.


Ha ha ha, This sounds just like the same argument that TC gave me back when I first started making the suggestion to people here to add the extra steel plate to there clutch packs.

Over time, heat and friction cause the clutch basket and pressure plate to wear out from the insides. These parts can only sandwich the clutch plates so much. After your basket is this worn, new frictions and heaver springs will only help for a shorter time (as short as 1500 miles for me once) until the new frictions wear below the space between the basket and pressure plate. The extra steel plate refills the space missing from your 20 something year old, 30,000 mile clutch system.

[Jerry]

Well, I have over 70K on the original clutch and basket, thousands of that pulling a trailer, and have had no clutch problems. Clutch is factory stock; I did pull it when I did my 2nd gear fix and checked the friction plates for wear and the pressure plated for flatness. Kept the stock springs. Don't know of a reason why an XS or XJ should have a worn-out clutch in 30K miles.

I used a piece of heavy glass as a backing and polished the pressure plates with 400 grit sandpaper. Glass confirmed the flatness, and sandpaper removed what little residue was on the plates. Using the same glass I also lightly sanded the friction plates to remove any glaze that was present.

Put everything back together and it has been working fine for the last 15K or so miles.

I'm not a clutch expert, but can't see where the basket would wear that would affect the friction/plate stack. The basket holds the plates in alignment only; the primary driven gear clearance is adjusted by the use of 2 thrust washers and a spacer. The only time I could see a failure of the type described is if the wrong spacer was used or the washers and/or spacer was worn. Also note that there are two different part numbers for the primary driven gear and spacers; Yamaha made an in-year change to this part.

From a 2004 post by T.C.:
*****************************
IF the primary driven gear/"clutch housing" or spacer are to be replaced, they must be sized to each other!! Each part is marked with either one or two lines. A primary drive with one line may be used with a spacer having either one or two lines, but a primary drive marked with two lines must be used with a spacer having two lines!

You'll find these line markings on the end of the spacer, and on the bottom/gear side of the basket, the outer wider gear ring, on it's edge viewing the gear teeth on their side, in other words, basket laying flat down with gear rings facing up towards you!
***********************
So, there are two different primary driven gears and two different "spacer 1" part numbers. You have to have the correct match depending on which primary driven gear you have.

Again, I'm not saying the extra plate does not work, but I am saying the need for one may mask a deeper problem that should be addressed.

[81xsproject]

Well, I have over 70K on the original clutch and basket, thousands of that pulling a trailer, and have had no clutch problems. Clutch is factory stock; I did pull it when I did my 2nd gear fix and checked the friction plates for wear and the pressure plated for flatness. Kept the stock springs. Don't know of a reason why an XS or XJ should have a worn-out clutch in 30K miles.

Jerry, I would say that maybe some folks are harder on clutches than you. I started to have slip issues with mine right after getting it on the road and it only had 17k on the clock back then. But, the bike was rescued out of an impound yard after some speed freak tried to out run the cops. Needless to say, I had to replace the timing cover and left crashbar