weaves at slow speeds

[prometheus578]

Probably referred to as a conversion kit... A lot of old bikes, as you know, had "uncaged" ball bearings in the steering head. These bearing kits are used as a replacement. Ours had caged bearings, but I suppose the term "conversion kit" is just a carry over.
These bearings are from a company called "All Balls", which all bike shops use.
I've used them for years... (just did mine last month.)

[egsols]

Mine seemed a little unstable when I first got it but PO had a set of flat drag bars on it. When I went back to the stock pull backs it made a huge difference.

[79XS11F]

Re: Conversion kit

Originally posted by fredintoon
Hi Jesse,
likely it's called a "conversion" because most of the other ones they sell are conversions to upgrade those bikes from their less sturdy crowded ball headraces.
For sure my XS11 has Timken head races as stock. While rubber goods such as the wiper seals may vary in quality, bearings is bearings. Yamaha and the aftermarket bearing guys both use stock industrial Timken races with the outer cones ground down to fit the steering head bearing pockets. Whichever you use, the main risk is in damage on installation.
Clymers says the head races must "move freely" but they are kinda vague in telling you how to achieve this.
Set the bike on the centrestand and jack up the frame so the front wheel is off the ground. Slacken the top tree pinchbolt and crown nut. Tighten the ring nuts that are just below the top tree until the bars stay central but will fall to either side when you give them a nudge to start them moving. Then retighten the pichbolt & crown nut.

That is to be done with the front end not installed. Once the front end in installed you need to remove any movement felt when you pull / push on the wheel. This work so long as there is no play in the forks. i test it by pulling / pushing while griping the upper part of the forks.
Rob

[jwoell]

Thanks for the input guys, it's cool having people around that know their shi ...er' I mean 'stuff' when it comes to these bikes. The info is much appreicated.

Thanks,
Jesse

[fredintoon]

" That is to be done with the front end not installed."
Hi Rob,
what is the "that" which is to be done with the front end not installed?
It surely can't be setting the headraces so they turn just right, because the only way to set the headraces IS with the front end installed. And what I was describing WAS how to set the headraces.

[jwoell]

What's my problem

I feel like I'm developing a shopping addiction here. I read a different post that mentioned bikebandit.com, looks like an awesome site. They refer to their parts as being OEM part, but I'm wondering if this is truly the case.

I'd like to just order every last thing I need for this front-end rebuild from one place (preferably an inexpensive place) but I'm wondering if I should trust the fork seals and such from bike bandit now!? I'm pretty confident on the bearings from what was mentioned by the other members here, but I don't wanna screw up and get the crappy fork seals.

Man, I'm sounding like a woman aren't I? Damn shopping addictions....son of a....

Later,
Jesse

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Jesse,

Okay, Bikebandit(BB) doesn't show the OEM part #'s, they substiture their own numbers, but when you are using the fiche and looking in the OEM parts section, you ARE getting OEM parts from Yamaha.

I use www.cycle-parts.com to check on OEM type prices, I use the Yamaha Online Fiche site to find the OEM #'s, and then put them into the search function of cycle-parts site to get the OEM $$'s, here's the comparison with BB:

BB seals $28.14

3J6-23145-00-00 OEM# fork seal

Bearings:
OME#upper:93332-00023-00 BB:$29.61
OEM#lower:93332-00008-00 BB:$29.61

Surprisingly BB showed both bearings to be the same #/part
Tapered bearing #32!
I put the "different" OEM #'s into cycle-parts search and it
also provided the SAME part# for upper and lower!

Cycle-parts.com
Fork seal: $25.19
Bearings, $26.50 ea same upper/lower

Now, before you go ordering those bearings, you may want to just take them apart and inspect first! They are TAPERED and so they handle stresses much better than the old round ball bearing style, and are less likely to put indents into the races. My bike, also 81SH sat outside for 9 years rusting, etc., and the steering felt very stiff, rough, ratchety! I took it apart, soaked the OPEN bearings in carb cleaner, then repacked them with bearing grease, cleaned the races.....NO DENTS, and they work flawlessly, much cheaper than actually replacing them! YMMV!
T.C.

[jwoell]

Thanks for the info T.C. that will make things alot simpler.

As far as the steering head bearings, I was taking a look at this thread

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...threadid=13027

The symptoms they describe are exactly what I'm feeling in my bike, so I was thinking I should just replace them. Kind of a do it right the first time so I don't have to do it again kind of thing. But I think I'll take your advice and dismantle the whole thing first and check out the condition of what is in there right now.

Thanks again for the info.

Jesse

[jwoell]

Well, I got it all torn down and all the parts should come in shortly. So here's the thing, I pulled the wheel and forks off and everything, so the front end is currently bare aside from the steering head.

So I've been reading this thread and really getting interested because my bike wanders alot...

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...g+head+bearing

Now with just the steering head open to mess with, I was trying to see if I might have similar indexing problems. So when I grabbed the steering head and just twisted it, I noticed a HUGE amount of indexing, even though I couldn't sense it at all with the forks and wheel on the bike. When I twisted the steering head by itself, it was extremely notchy.

So here's my question, how does a guy prevent the indexing in these bearings from occurring? I get that they need to be greased properly and the torque on the main bolt needs to be in spec, but is there any other way to make sure things wear properly, instead of getting all notchy?

Just looking for thoughts and opinions, I don't really want to have to tear apart the front end regularly, but I will if I have too.

Thanks guys,
Jesse

[AlanB]

Hi jwoell,

It is easy to avoid the "Indexing"; don't overtighten 'em, don't let 'em get rusty, and don't crash it!

With normal use, correct adjustment, and some grease every decade or so, they should last (almost!) for ever.

I had to change mine a couple of years ago to fit more modern forks to my '81, but the set I took out were unmarked.

AlanB

[jwoell]

Thanks for the info. I would hope that would be the case where you just have to do simple stuff like keeping them greased.

I know for a fact that the bike has never been in any sort of accident, I got it from my step-father, so the history is known. He's not the most mechanically inclined guy in the world though, so he may have never greased the bearings up ever, I dunno. We shall see about the tightening though, the front end may never have been off ever, I'm guessing it never has been.

Anyway, thanks for the info.

Jesse

[AlanB]

Hi jwoell,

Sounds like you have found your problem, but have a read of this, from a "Cycle" report from Jan '79;

"If you've studied the specification sheet you've noticed that the SF has the same rake/trail dimensions as the Eleven Standard. You have also noticed that the Special has a forward-mount front axle, and we'll tell you that the chassis are identical. Under normal circumstances offsetting the front axle would reduce trail by the exact horizontal amount of the offset. That hasn't happened here, because the fork pipes are carried at an angle 1.5 degrees steeper than that of the steering head, thus retaining the Standard's 130mm (5.11 in.) trail dimension.

There is one curious side-effect: the Special is peculiarly unstable at very low speeds (below 10 mph). By moving the axle forward, the mass of the front wheel and all that brake apparatus creates a pendulum effect that is not nearly so noticeable on the Standard. Too, both bikes run a ton of rake - 29.5 degrees (by contrast, the CBX's fork is raked at 27.25 degrees, the Kawasaki KZ1000's at 26 degrees. This angle adds to the pendulum effect - which disappears as soon as the motorcycle achieves enough speed for the front wheel's self-aligning properties to take over."

In other words, they all do that!

Full article HERE! (CLICK!)

Thanks to Brian on the UK site; I stole this direct from him!

AlanB

[chaklid]

weaving

try looking at your forks; are they in proper compliance regarding air pressure, oil level?? see if they are leaking around the seals at all!!