xs-o-s "help"

[ACE]

I hope someone can help with some answers here?
I bought another 78 XS1100E a moth ago, a real keeper.
The engine, and everything else, was removed for powder coating the frame.
he said it ran fine before this.
What was left to do was hook the wiring up , a few minor things and try it.
the carbs were crap.
I took a set off my parts bike that i new ran good.
Ok, i cranked it up again and it souned fine.
Good idle, good throttle response.
I was ready to try this thing, well no front brakes assembled yet, but who can wait?
I rode it around the barn yard , still ok.
Out ao the road it sounded good as i took off in first gear.
I hit second and opened it up.
all i got was alot of missing.
Third was ok until i opened it up again.
It seems alright till it gets a few rpm"s and under load it starts to miss.
it was only 28 degress. so I parked it in the shop trying to warm up.
It won't get the best of me!.
while i sat there shivering, it seems to me , maybe sark or timing.
It runs so good without a load.
Any advice or question would bee greatly appreciated.
I've waited many years to get another 1100 and , well, i won't to RIDE the damn thing.
**##*^!!^&!!!!!!
Can I cuss here?

[strom]

I got a similar problem. Not producing what seems more that 30HP for bout 5-7secs, then RPM drops to 500-1000 and wont climb up no matter what I do. I have to wait for bout 1/2 an hour, then all I can repeat the whole thing over again... The plugs are wet and black, so are the carbs (wet), it has spark on all 4, carb floats are closing petrol supply, I tried different ignition coils, another TCI, measured pick-up coils, changed the ballast resistor, it all looks OK to me.

I'll pull the carbs (for the fifth or sixth time) today and I'll raise the main jets. Any other ideas... I think it's running waaay too rich and I don't know what else to do.

BTW: I adjusted the timing on the pick-up coil unit with a strobe lamp. Seems fine.

Hell, I rode bout 100m today... between snowflakes. I hate snow.

LP

[dwales]

I had a lack of power on my 78. Turned out to be a blocked exhaust. The bike ran rich and the exhaust was sooted up. Good luck.

[strom]

My exhaust is fine.. well... not much of the exhaust to get anything stuck in there.
Didn't pull the carbs yet... other stuff to do.

LP

[ACE]

Oh boy,
i hate to hear the i tried everything!
Well the exaust is brand new.
The carbs came off a running bike.
I have two others with good parts.
So I guess i'll start with timing and switching parts.
I work 11 to 12 hours a day and i hate snow! So this leaves me with little time during the week.
Tonight i did notice that since i rode it the fuel has settled down.
I put on in-line filters and saw air bubbles.
The fuel came up to the fuel bowls and no farther.
it's time to try it again but bed time to.
I'll be sure to post the problem i find, well,
i'll find it!
Thanks and i'm still all ears.

[TopCatGr58]

Not sure if this may help!?

Originally posted by ACE
Oh boy,
i hate to hear the i tried everything!
Well the exaust is brand new.
The carbs came off a running bike.
I have two others with good parts.
So I guess i'll start with timing and switching parts.
I work 11 to 12 hours a day and i hate snow! So this leaves me with little time during the week.
Tonight i did notice that since i rode it the fuel has settled down.
I put on in-line filters and saw air bubbles.
The fuel came up to the fuel bowls and no farther.
it's time to try it again but bed time to.
I'll be sure to post the problem i find, well,
i'll find it!
Thanks and i'm still all ears.

Hey there Ace,
I'm not a carb guru, or even a mechanic guru, but it looks like not too many people are jumping here with any possible ideas, so I thought I'd try.

I got some bad gas on my last rally in NC, and for a few hours I had poor low end response and one of my carbs acted like it was leaking/stuck float valve, so I had 1 rich carb that really messed up the response, I either had Wide Open Throttle, or nothing at all during that time, until the crappy gas got run thru the system, and the piece of crud got flushed thru the carb so that my float wasn't sticking.

One line above makes me think you may have too long of fuel lines, if they are looped well below the carb float bowl levels, where you state the fuel in the line only came 'up' to the bowls!!?? Although I've read posts from Mr. Hart and others about running longer lines with loops that extend below the carbs and they state their fuel flows "up" to the carb 'T's, I would still wonder, especially with filters, they might also be restricting the fuel flow, so I would try to shorten the lines, so that you get the best gravity flow affect, turn the "T" inbetween the carbs so that it's at least level if not pointing up towards the tank and have the lines not go below that level.

Also, the borrowed carbs were off of another XS, what year? The 78-79 are fairly different from the 80-81 from what I've read, and have a tricky vent tube that is needed to be open to allow fuel to flow. The bike revs without load because it doesn't take much fuel to spin the engine without any load on it, but under load, it requires more.....so I'm thinking it's still a fuel flow problem. What RPM's are you getting it up to before you shift to 2nd? You should be able to take it to 5K+, if you're shifting at 3K, then you're bogging the machine, especially when it's cold and perhaps not really warmed up all the way, especially in 28 degree weather, it gets air cooled quickly at that temp!

Are you sure you vacuum advance module is working, and that it plugged into the proper port on the carbs, not onto the intake mount port?? You did get fresh gas didn't you?? Just some thoughts, write back with more details. When you had it idling and such, did you still have the CHOKE pulled out/engaged? With the air filters off with engine running, when you blip the throttle can you see the vacuum slides rise up at all, are you sure the vacuum slides are working well?? What do the plugs look like?

Good luck

[shrubberman]

I know mine runs pretty crappy like that, with the air filter off.

[ACE]

Thank you very much!
i can't say much yet, i worked 14 hours, got stopped for speeding in my truck, have to go in at 4 in the morning, not a good day.
What you just said about the lines and filter makes alot of sense.
The tees point down so i'll fix that and shorten the lines up.
the carbs are the same year.
The gas, well, it made the other bike run ok but it is getting old.
my hat is off to you top hat!

[strom]

OK, I took off the washers beneath (above) main jets, effectivly raising them. The mid range improved signifficantly, the bike pulls strong, but as soon as RPM falls, it won't come up again. Gonna reinstall the washers and lower gas level in the bowls.

LP

[ACE]

Ok, can anyone tell me if going to four filters from anair box could cause this missing at mid rpm under a load?
Just a thought.

[Chuck Olds]

Originally posted by ACE
Ok, can anyone tell me if going to four filters from anair box could cause this missing at mid rpm under a load?
Just a thought.

Yes, it's possible. When I bought my 79 Special, it had indy filters and had a miss at what I called high rpm, but I think it was only in 5th gear at high speed or under heavy acceleration in the higher rpm range of 5th gear. I'm not certain of that with the passage of time. It could have been in 3rd or 4th gear thru 5th, or something like that, but no miss in the lower gears at any rpm. That was also with old gas. Yours may miss at lower rpm than mine due to needing a jet change or float level adj. I can't get technical on any of this, only offer my experience. The only change I made to solve this problem, besides add new gas, was add the airbox with a new air filter and the miss went away. I had not yet ridden the bike with the airbox installed before this. The result was strong and smooth acceleration through all gears to around 110 mph. I ran out of road at that point, but bike had a lot left in it, just ask my wife. Had to try it out you know. My bike has a 4-1 exhaust and probably needed re-jetting to be able to use the indy's extra airflow. I've had my bike since '95 and not yet had to tear the carbs down. I'm knocking on wood!

Strom's problem doesn't appear to be the same as yours IMHO. T.C. did a great job troubleshooting the carb possibilities there, for starters. I'd really work on checking out the vacuum advance if it was me and the problem didn't improve substantially by working on T.C.'s recommendations.

Of course, it could just be coincidence that our symptoms were the same and the problem lies in totally different areas, Ace. Good luck.

[ACE]

Top cat's advice was excellant.
Yours makes a lot of sense to.
this weekend i'll put it to use and see what happens.
All i've done so far is switch the coils.
I do have a good spark now when before it seemed week.
Thank you gentlemen!

I hate keyboards like i hate the winter.

[strom]

Adjusted the pilot screws today to specs (1 1/4 turn outs), but the problem persists. Doh!

Gonna pull the carbs, re-re-re-re-check the float height, and see if they're closing properly.

Im runnin out of ideas...

LP

[ACE]

This is going to be a real learning experiance!
I started with Top Cats ideas. I hope your still there.
I put new gas in the tank. I found a petcock wasn't right so i hade another and switched it.
I found the filters on petcocks were still good so i pulled off the inline filters and shortened the lines above the fuel bowls.
I did change to good coils, another ignition box, checked the timing, vacum advance, pick up coils should be good.
the wires i still want to check with ohm meter.
the slides in carb all seem to work.
OK, it still runs the same.
any gear when the rpms get to about 5000 it starts to miss when i open it up.
first taking off and crusing it runs ok.
So this is where Mr Chuck Olds seems to make sense.
When I got this bike it came with new 2 into 1 exaust, don't know what kind.
They took the air box off and put on single filters.
The carbs came off a good running 1979 f
Mine is a 1978e
The 1979 f is all stock.
this makes me think to try the old air box.
i'm not comfy yet trying to rejet this thing.
i checked the plugs which were new.
At idlie it seems real rich. not so running down the road.
the plugs have black around the edges but center and electrode are a real light tan, not quite white. am i right about being lean?
and what should i look for about running rich at idle?
i will try the air box next but any other tips, i'm all ears!
thanks for the good tips so far.
I saw dennis Kirk has rejet kits for our bikes to fit ones with after market exaust and filters but $113.00! WOW

[strom]

The story of the EViL XS

The damn bastard tried to unscrew my head yesterday.

I pulled one of the plugs to check for color and spark... and the damn thing wouldn't come off the wrench. It's an old one, soft and weird. So I put the plug in the stuff-holder-thingie and tried to pry the wrench off with a screwdriver, which broke and the pointy half landed in my forhead. Got me woozy enuff to go for another 50m ride in the snow. It was fun, but I nearly fell 3 times going up the incline from my garage and scared a neighbour with the lovely exhaust note. I had a friend with me, who also head a near death experience (from laughing so hard).
Did I mention I hate winter? Im gonna have another carb session, then I'll do a complete electrical rewire.
I'm getting real pissed off with this bike. I'd put it in a shop but I don't trust the mechanics. Any of 'em.

LP