Get the SHIMS OUT

[DELL82]

How can I get the SHIMS out from inside the valves? Currently the valve cover is off. I have taken readings to within 0.0005"(0.0127mm) as follows:
Exhaust / Intake
#1 0.007(0.18) / 0.006(0.15)
#2 0.0075(0.19) / 0.007(0.18)
#3 0.007(0.18) / 0.007(0.18)
#4 0.0085(0.22) / 0.004(0.10)
The local Yamarobber MECH(Good German) says that I need to change the Intake shims but the Exhaust are alright!
Can someone on the list help with this so I can get LASERMAX back on the road. The #1 Intake valve cup was very difficult to rotate and the shim will not budge in reference to the cup, have applied B2 last night. I have a magnet and made a valve compression holder that bolts to the head using one of the valve cover mounting holes. Also where can I get shims if needed.
HELP

[DiverRay]

Dell,
I use a small pick or flat blade screwdriver to start the shims. They seem to stick to the buckets after a few thousand miles of running. There is a slot in the bucket, you need to rotate that so it is towards the inside of the engine. You then compress the valve wit hthe diil, rotate the cam lobe BACK till it almost hits the tool, and use the pick to loosen the shim. The magnet will take it out, once loose.
I don't remember the exact numbers for the clearance, but you need to remember the shims should ONLY go one size up or down. Do a search and I'm sure you can find the chart that has been posted a few times.
Ray

[DELL82]

THANKS Ray, I have rotated the slot around to the inside but cannot get the shim to raise with a pick or small screw driver. The shim is stuck to the bucket hard. Since the shim only contacts the cam in the relative center, does the underside of the shim have a taper chamfer so that I can push down on the outer edge of the shim from the side opposite to the slot in order to raise the shim? This would seem a good idea to me

[Ken Talbot]

This link will take you to one source of shim thickness tables . Many times, you can swap shims one for one at a repair shop, especially if you can get past the front counter and talk with a mechanic. Be prepared to pay a couple of bucks per swap even this way.

[DiverRay]

Dell82,
Are you SURE your tool isn't interfering with the bucket? You can try and "push" on one side of the shim, but I'm not sure it will work. They end up with a "vacum" holding them in from the oil on the sides, top, and bottom.
Do try to "swap" shims. The Suzuki uses the same diameter shim on some models, so If the Yamarobber want's you to buy the new ones, at $13.95 each, try a different dealer or independant repair shop.
Ray

[DELL82]

Thanks Ray, will try again tonight. Something off subject: Do you know what the original XJ1100J saddle bags and wind shield look like? Did it also come with a front faring, and what did it look like? I have tried to find it on the net without luck.

[DiverRay]

Dell82,
Sorry, most of my experience is with the '78 and '79 models. I know in '79 Yamaha wnt to a "Pacifico" fairing based on the windjammer. I think they stayed with that type throughout the model run. For the saddlebags and fairing, look to the '81 or '82 "Venturer" model XJ1100. That is only a guess, but it should be close. Now a day, I would look for something that can be modified to fit the bike. Any Vetter Windjammer will fit with the proper mount. The secret is trying to find the mount. For saddle bags, almost any type can be fit. The mounts are usually easier to modify, and the clearance isn't so tight as the fairing.
Ray

[mro]

Hi ya DELL82

Have had a few shims that did not want to cooperate. Took a "thin" flat head screw driver to my bench grinder and finished the bevel on one side, stuck it to the shim and tapped with a hammer to get it loose from bucket.

mro
btw
stealing a pic from MAXIMAN, Flat out the hotest XJ there is

[skids]

As you rotate the cam with the tool installed, the bucket and shim should not rise (for the most part). The tool''s tang needs to contact the edge of the bucket to hold it down (not in the slot). The "adhesion" of the oil film between the bucket and shim must be pryed apart with a jewlers screwdriver or the like. An extendable magnet is a big help to pull the dislodged shim out through the opening.

[trbig]

Dell,

As stated, the shim just has a good suction built up. A sharp-edged jewler's screwdriver tapped in between the bucket and shim at that gap should dislodge it.

According to your measurements, on the intake side, your #4 needs one size down number-wise... meaning thinner. (.11~.15mm for XJ) Your number 2 and 3 are a bit on the high side, but you could leave them alone. It may make them slightly noisier, but the gap between your cam and shim will SHRINK and get tighter clearances over time, not get wider. But a shim one size up would put them right in the middle of the range. I would shim them, but it's your call.

On your Exhaust side, your #4 is within range (.21~.25 for XJ), but your other 3 could use one size thinner shim. Let me know what sizes you have/ need. I have some and would swap straight across with you if I have what you need. Just remember to put these numbers face down against the buckets when re-installing.

Tod

[prometheus578]

"Confusing time waster."

Ignore that shim chart. Each shim is graduated in .05mm's... which comes to .002 inches. So a change of one shim size will move the clearance .002 inches.
If a valve clearance is .006 and you want .008, go down one shim size. Doesn't get easier than that.
Double check the shims you get from shops during an exchange. Our shims are a common size, used by most brands: 29mm diameter.
Some Suzuki's take a 29.5mm which will not fit our buckets.

[Czekus21]

If your still having problems getting the shims out, you may want to try a small magnet/pick combo. This is the method I used doing mine.

[Bauer]

im with MRO and TRBIG, if the shims are stuck hard, a small flat blade screwdriver and hammer will work wonders, tap the screwdriver in until the shim is rased enough to possibly grab with a needlenose.

HOWEVER, DO NOT TAP THE SCREWDRIVER IN FAR ENOUGH TO PUT ANY EXCESS PRESSURE ON THE SHIM, THEY HAVE BEEN KNOWN TO BREAK. USE THE HAMMER/SCREWDRIVER METHOD AS A LAST DITCH EFFORT

[DELL82]

Thanks all for the help with the stuck shims, Small screw driver and hammer did the trick. I need a better war to lower the cup, now using a screw driver between the bottom of the cam and the cup lip with a strong magnet next to the shim while the screwdriver is holding the shim up, trickey but worked.
I replaced the #4 intake from 280 to 275 and the clearance was just right. I chose to leave the #2&3 as is until I can get the Exhaust out and see what numbers are there, then I can get with trbig about swapping them out for the proper ones. I will need #270's for #2&3 as there is #265 in there now.
Once back together,w/NEW gasket she fired right up, with some noise. Mostly the bike is very cold tempered and needs starter fluid to start but idles Okay once warm. Got a run in ,141Mi, and looked at the plugs and all were white as the driven snow. Adjusted the pilot screws to two turns out from 1-1/2 and tried , 23Mi, only to find the plugs are still white How far can I adjust out the pilot screws to get the straw color, or is it jets that need changing! Currently jets are stock, mufflers are not stock but look like they are, air filter is stock.
THANKS ALL FOR INPUT

[randy]

I will need #270's for #2&3 as there is #265 in there now.

?? Shouldn't the shim sizing ALWAYS go down, not up? Valve wear into the head, so you should need a smaller shim to restore the proper clearance.