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  • #16
    Personally I like the new Concours look better. It's much meaner looking and more agressive. The Honda ST kinda has a scooter look to me. The Beemer a little more sporty...a real sport tourer kinda like the old Connie. The Fudger is even sportier styled than the BMW but I still don't see it as a Super Sport.

    The New Concours is definitely an SS Touring machine. It looks like a HUGE Ninja on steriods with a sane seating position and integrated hardbags. From the front this machine looks like a fighter jet compared to the FJR. The headlight configuration on the Concours looks like the eyes of a raptor (eagle, falcon. hawk). The FJR looks more like tweety bird.

    Of course that's just my opinion.

    Note the Fudgers "puppy ear" mirrors versus the Concours aerodynamic integrated rear monitors.





    As far as looks?...the Fudger looks like a very fast motorcyle (yawn) compared to the Concours .... looks like a very fast missile.

    The mechanics of the Flying Kaw may not be up to par...that remains to be seen. But the styling is much more agressive and appealing to me personally ... it gets my adrenaline pumping just looking at it.
    Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-01-2007, 05:54 PM.

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    • #17
      Riding home from John and Kat's yesterday from the Dallas area, I tucked in behind one of these Concourses. I got to check it out in action. We zipped around through traffic a bit and cruised about 95-100mph for a bit. His bike was quicker than mine, but to be honest, he never would/could just haul off and leave me. He probably had a higher top end, but never got past what mine is. I'm sure he'd kill me in the down low torque, but with mine up in the power zone above 5k, he really didn't impress me a lot.

      The side mirrors... although large and cool looking... he had to move his arms to actually see in them. He was also taking a hell of a beating with that windshield being so low.

      A bit less enthused after seeing it in action... Just my 2 cents.


      Tod
      Try your hardest to be the kind of person your dog thinks you are.

      You can live to be 100, as long as you give up everything that would make you want to live to be 100!

      Current bikes:
      '06 Suzuki DR650
      *'82 XJ1100 with the 1179 kit. "Mad Maxim"
      '82 XJ1100 Completely stock fixer-upper
      '82 XJ1100 Bagger fixer-upper
      '82 XJ1100 Motor/frame and lots of boxes of parts
      '82 XJ1100 Parts bike
      '81 XS1100 Special
      '81 YZ250
      '80 XS850 Special
      '80 XR100
      *Crashed/Totalled, still own

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by trbig
        He probably had a higher top end, but never got past what mine is. ...

        A bit less enthused after seeing it in action... Just my 2 cents.


        Tod
        Oh it's not really that fast on top end. The rev limiter in 6th kicks in at about 7500 (red line is 10,500). ...so Cycle World could only get the old Kaw up 160 mph. Not really that much faster than your Maxim...didn't you say you once had it to 140?

        But seriously...the top speed test on this bike as with all other bikes is done in top gear which on the Concours is overdrive and serverely limited. However the bike is not limited so severely in 5th. The limiter kicks in at redline in fifth of 10,500 rpm. One new Connie owner has already indicated to me that in fifth he can easily plant the needle (indicated 180). And this is pretty much supported by gear reduction calculations. In fifth the bike would easily exceed 170 mph even considering typical optimistic Jap speedometers.......if you're crazy enough to take it there.

        And if the rev limiter were removed in overdrive the bike would theoretically top out at 227 mph. Of course it would go nowhere in that range...it only looks it. But suffice it to say it is damn fast...faster than most of us old toothless gray hair will ever push it.

        Comment


        • #19
          Hey I still got some teeth.
          http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1241/1480921818_241eade448_s.jpg

          Comment


          • #20
            I talk with Hippie Dave pretty frequently and get to hear all the stories about the Busa. Even though I have got all my teeth and the grey hair is coming... I still think I'd try to see what the bike could do... whatever it was. That's why I better stick right here with these little toys we all have and keep the HP under 100. BUT... the 1179 kit will be here soon!


            Tod
            Try your hardest to be the kind of person your dog thinks you are.

            You can live to be 100, as long as you give up everything that would make you want to live to be 100!

            Current bikes:
            '06 Suzuki DR650
            *'82 XJ1100 with the 1179 kit. "Mad Maxim"
            '82 XJ1100 Completely stock fixer-upper
            '82 XJ1100 Bagger fixer-upper
            '82 XJ1100 Motor/frame and lots of boxes of parts
            '82 XJ1100 Parts bike
            '81 XS1100 Special
            '81 YZ250
            '80 XS850 Special
            '80 XR100
            *Crashed/Totalled, still own

            Comment


            • #21
              No doubt...the Eleven is more than enough to thrill you AND kill you.

              As far as a Busa...I once buried the needle on this ZXR (indicated 170). What can I say ... I had a lapse in judgement... ...still it is a risky proposition to take a two wheeled vehicle to that speed on a public road. I can't fathom what anyone would ever do with something like a Busa or the ever potent ZX14. You certainly can only use a fraction of that power 95% of the time.

              OTOH I can see a practical use for the Concours. The engine is really tuned for broad range power. Yes it will shag...but that is not it's primary purpose. It's primary purpose is to shag...TWO UP!

              It's for certain the "governor" will never do it. She starts getting nervous in Zilla at 80.
              Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-01-2007, 11:41 PM.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Meatloaf
                Yamaha does seem to creep into your life without you knowing.

                It starts with a dirt bike, then a streetbike, then it's an ATV, a snowmobile, boat motor, electronics, underwear....
                I had a couple of Yamaha guitars that were the center of my life (until they were stolen)
                Pat Kelly
                <p-lkelly@sbcglobal.net>

                1978 XS1100E (The Force)
                1980 XS1100LG (The Dark Side)
                2007 Dodge Ram 2500 quad-cab long-bed (Wifes ride)
                1999 Suburban (The Ship)
                1994 Dodge Spirit (Son #1)
                1968 F100 (Valentine)

                "No one is totally useless. They can always be used as a bad example"

                Comment


                • #23
                  Concours Gear Ratios

                  Of course a Concours will shut down an XS, a stock one for sure but a Concours according to CW will (only) run 160 mph on the top end and not a penny more. It has an over all gear ratio in high gear of 3.4. 5th. gear is 1.29, 6th. is 1.074 and the final drive is 2.036. I got these numbers from the shop manual. Untill we get some data on the drag factor of both, we will not know which is best aerodynamically as it's diffulcult to tell just from looking at them. Function and form are more important than style and after sitting on them both I think the mirrows on the FJR are easier to see out of than the type used on the Kaw and I think the head lights on the Concours looks like the eyes of a drunken far sighted fat woman at a karaoke party on a Monday night. This party is not over as the fat lady has yet to sing.
                  81 Black "1179" Xcessively trick Super Special. One owner (me).

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Concours Gear Ratios

                    Originally posted by Dan Hodges
                    5th. gear is 1.29, 6th. is 1.074 and the final drive is 2.036. I got these numbers from the shop manual. Untill we get some data on the drag factor of both, we will not know which is best aerodynamically as it's diffulcult to tell just from looking at them.
                    I know...I gave 'em to ya. And the primary reduction ratio is 1.556. So in 5th gear the overall drive ratio is 4.093.

                    Using that ratio and a 24.8 inch OD tire and a redline of 10,500 the calculator says 189 mph in 5th.

                    However we all know the Big Concours is really a piece of sh!t and will pull no where near redline even in 5th gear (and probably not even 4th) because the engine is simply overated and the cams are way too big for the bogus valve seat diameters. Add to that the fact the damn thing has about as much aerodynamic efficiency as a parachute and I doubt it will break into the triple digit range.

                    Ok...enough satire...the fact is Psycho Ward ...and I've said this hundred times I might as well say it agian...tested that bike in top gear....which is an overdrive. Why they did not test it in 5th for top speed I'll never know. It's like the bogus 60 - 80 roll on test they did. The Fudger was tested in 5th gear and rang up 3.2 seconds. The C14 rang up 4.7 seconds. What? that doesn't make sense!

                    Well duh! The C14 was in overdrive. If they were intellectually honest they would have put the bike in 5th and it would have spun up a number as good or better than the FJR. The idiots at Psycho Ward don't recognize 6th on the Connie as an overdrive. Those numbnuts just see it as "top gear".

                    I can't help it if the Yamadogs did not have the foresight to put a an overdrive on the FJR. The day they released that bike I was shocked to read the specs that it only had a 5 speed.

                    So if Psycho Ward screwed that test up...who knows what in the heck else they screwed up.

                    Lastly, even though the calculator says the C14 will do 189 in 5th....anyone with more than dust for brains knows it won't do that because of size and resulting aerodynamic drag. However ...after talking to two other Concours owners...it painfully obvious to me the C14 will easily exceed what the numbnuts at Psycho Ward rang up on their top speed test. So it seems the truth lies somewhere between 160 and 189. And as soon as I buy one you can bet your azz I'll find out. ...and you'll be the first to know.
                    Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-02-2007, 12:29 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Concours Gear Ratios

                      Originally posted by Dan Hodges
                      Function and form are more important than style...
                      Personally for me function can only go so far. Obviously if a bike is utterly disfunctional it doesn't matter how beautiful it is. I don't think that is the case with the Connie.

                      OTOH if a bike is butt ugly I don't care HOW practical it is I don't want it. There again I don't think that is the case with the Fudger. All in all it's a nice looking machine. Having said that...in my "Shallow Hal" world the Concours is simply better looking. YMMV (your mileage may vary)

                      Case in point......


                      TALK ABOUT PRACTICAL! If you crack the frame doing wheelies forget about the dealer....ya just go to LOWES for repair!




                      ...and I think the head lights on the Concours looks like the eyes of a drunken far sighted fat woman at a karaoke party on a Monday night. This party is not over as the fat lady has yet to sing.


                      Well that just goes to prove beauty is in the eye of the beholder.









                      .



                      I think this looks good ... still others think it looks like dog doo on a paper plate. YMMV



                      Are we having fun yet?


                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by trbig
                        The side mirrors... although large and cool looking... he had to move his arms to actually see in them.
                        I really don't understand this statement. To see "what" in them...HIS ARMS? I read a review where the reporter complained ofr not being able to see.

                        So I went to the Kawasaki dealer today...put the bike up on the center stand and crawled up in the cockpit. Then I had a couple of the floor guys walk all around me in the back at a variety of distances.

                        I had no problem seeing them ANYWHERE. I tried every way POSSIBLE I could to block the view of the mirrors with my arms. It simply could not be done. Actually after this little test I am even more convinced of the superb design of the rearview mirrors on this bike. The mirrors actually sit below arm level. You have to dangle your arms intentionally to obscure the view.

                        They are more than wide enough to see past the hard bags and with a passenger on the pillion even their legs are not in the way. I have no earthly idea how one could screw up the rearview on this bike ... it is superb.

                        So I went to the Yamaha dealer and did same on the FJR. The rearview on this bike is just as good. I had no problem seeing to the rear on the Fudger either. Very good design.

                        So now it just boils down to which reaview mirror style I prefer. With regard to this one issue it is no contest...in my warped view of aesthetics (prefaced in the pre-scribed photo) I think the Concours fairing and rearview mirrors are much more attractive. Toeach his own I suppose.

                        Now for the test ride!
                        Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-02-2007, 11:15 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Re: Concours Gear Ratios

                          Ok...enough satire...the fact is Psycho Ward ...and I've said this hundred times I might as well say it agian...tested that bike in top gear....which is an overdrive. Why they did not test it in 5th for top speed I'll never know. It's like the bogus 60 - 80 roll on test they did. The Fudger was tested in 5th gear and rang up 3.2 seconds. The C14 rang up 4.7 seconds. What? that doesn't make sense!

                          Well duh! The C14 was in overdrive. If they were intellectually honest they would have put the bike in 5th and it would have spun up a number as good or better than the FJR. The idiots at Psycho Ward don't recognize 6th on the Connie as an overdrive. Those numbnuts just see it as "top gear".

                          I can't help it if the Yamadogs did not have the foresight to put a an overdrive on the FJR. The day they released that bike I was shocked to read the specs that it only had a 5 speed.

                          So if Psycho Ward screwed that test up...who knows what in the heck else they screwed up.

                          Lastly, even though the calculator says the C14 will do 189 in 5th....anyone with more than dust for brains knows it won't do that because of size and resulting aerodynamic drag. However ...after talking to two other Concours owners...it painfully obvious to me the C14 will easily exceed what the numbnuts at Psycho Ward rang up on their top speed test. So it seems the truth lies somewhere between 160 and 189. And as soon as I buy one you can bet your azz I'll find out. ...and you'll be the first to know. [/B][/QUOTE] CW does their roll on test in high gear whatever the gear ratio happens to be and if the Kaw pilot downshifted one hole, the Yamadog pilot would be doing like wise. If both shifted all the way down to first and went from a dead stop to 60 mph the Kaw would lose, at least it did in the Cycle World test. My friend has his CB 1000 Honda which has 5 regular speeds plus a high and low range which effectively gives him ten speeds and over the years I have raced him from a 60 mph roll on my XS and he has always lost and if he downshifted so did I because it's not Yamaha's fault Honda put more gears in it than he needs.Technically speaking, an OD gear is any transmission gear ratio that is less than 1 to 1, i.e. .99-.89 and so forth. 6th. gear in the Concours is 1.074 and so technically it is not an overdrive, just another gear. My old V-65 Sabre would run almost as fast in 5th as it would in 6th because it's 6th was an OD because the 6th gear transmission ratio was .89. Both the Concours and FJR have scads of grunt and both have relatively tall top gears and unless speeds in excess 150 or so are desired, a 6th gear is not needed. More gears add weight and complexity and each gear is worth a plus or minus of 1%-1.5% of hp. Yamaha's little 1000cc screaming meanies have 6 speeds because they make their power at 12,500 rpm but a grunt motor like the 1300 FJR need's only 5 speeds to do the job. Back in the eighties, the Kawasaki Eliminators and V-65's all had 6 speeds while the Yamaha FJ, V-Max and the old XS made do with 5. When you go out for a ride on a Sunday afternoon, you see lot's of old FJ's and V-Maxes but seldom ever an Eliminator or V-65 with their trick valve trains and 6 speed transmissions. Will the Concours do over a 160 mph, maybe, maybe not, but I just hope the Oklahoma State Police doesn't have to chase you down on their Busa while you are attempting to find out because when they catch you, your ass will be going straight to jail minus the Concours which will be suspended from the hook of a tow truck.
                          81 Black "1179" Xcessively trick Super Special. One owner (me).

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Say what? OHP won't be able to catch me...because I am not damn fool enough to do that in Oklahoma. I will go back home and do the deed on 385 south of Crane, Texas. Not only is there no people out there in the desert....there are even fewer troopers.

                            Of course you'll need to ride down there with me on that Fudge Bar to witness the test and if I crash you can call the morgue...an ambulance would be a waste of time at that speed.



                            If both shifted all the way down to first and went from a dead stop to 60 mph the Kaw would lose, at least it did in the Cycle World test.
                            Yeah the Kawaski lost 0-60 by .1 seconds. But... it won 0-30. It won 0-90. It won 0-100. It won 0 to 126.54 and it won 0 - 160 mph.....

                            And consider this....IT'S HUGE! It dwarfs the Fudger when sitting side by side. If it was a light as the Fudger it would obliterate the thing.

                            But I wouldn't want it any other way. That is what is sooooo appealing about this bike to me. It's big AND fast. It has MUCHO storage in those monster hardbags and every one including Psycho Ward agrees it runs circles around the FJR in handling.

                            And believe me if the "governor" starts ridng with me I'll need all the storage I can get. I'm sure she could fill one of those mega hardbags with nothing but makeup!
                            Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-02-2007, 07:30 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Kawabunga

                              The Concours lost the roll on contest, the braking contest, the load carrying capacity contest, the fuel capacity and range contest, the beauty contest and for me the overall sitting position on the bike.The quarter mile times on these two are seperated by only .04 of a second which is about as close as you can get without a tie. What about those valve adjustment shims on the Concours, are they below or on top of the bucket? I'll bet taking those cams out to adjust the valves is a real thrill. The total package is what's important and because of the closeness of the performance of these bikes that would be an individual choice.
                              81 Black "1179" Xcessively trick Super Special. One owner (me).

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Kawabunga

                                Originally posted by Dan Hodges
                                The Concours lost the roll on contest, the braking contest, the load carrying capacity contest, the fuel capacity and range contest, the beauty contest and for me the overall sitting position on the bike.The quarter mile times on these two are seperated by only .04 of a second which is about as close as you can get without a tie.
                                According to whom? Psycho Ward? If the Psycho Ward is your Bible then praise the Lord and pass the plate. But other test have had different results. I'll be posting them later.

                                As matter of fact the last review Psycho Ward made of this bike said comparing it to the FJR and the BMW "It makes more power everywhere. It's just a better power plant."

                                Here's the proof from the October issue of Cycle World. Read it for yourself



                                What about those valve adjustment shims on the Concours, are they below or on top of the bucket? I'll bet taking those cams out to adjust the valves is a real thrill. The total package is what's important and because of the closeness of the performance of these bikes that would be an individual choice.
                                First off this may affect you. Not me. I won't touch that valve train. That's Mr. Dealers job.

                                It's really no big deal. Besides if I don't like it I'll get rid of it. It's just a motorcycle.

                                The total pakage is DEFINITELY what's important. And the Concours appears to be a superior "total" package than the FJR in my "humble" opinion... Hehehehehe.

                                Plus it will run circles around the Fudger in the twisties. Every review has said this...Even your boys at Psycho Ward. They said the FJR has LESS cornering clearance than the Concours.

                                Here....read it yourself...



                                For those of you in Rio Linda this has nothing to do with ground clearance. Cornering clearance has to do with how hard you can take a curve and not scrape the paint off something. And Maximan DUZZZ like to ride this way.

                                RAY you listening RAY ...I can't wait to take this overgrown Ninja on the road north of Fort Bragg!

                                Everything I've read says the FJR is notorious for responding a bit mushy when pushed hard in the "Dragon Tails" of roads. The bigger...heavier Concours out performs the Fudger in this wise.

                                Strange ...no?

                                Not really. Kawasaki just did their homework.

                                Face it...it's starting to add up. It's a better bike. It's bigger ...it's faster...it's way better looking than the FJR.... Looks like the Concours just may turn out to be...yet another one of Kawasakis history making bikes like the Z1.

                                Save me a place in line.

                                PS: Besides...I just can't get past that stupid looking seat on the Fudger.
                                Last edited by MAXIMAN; 10-02-2007, 11:49 PM.

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