Question about a rechargeable mig wire feed welder

[xj11john]

I had a Matco tools rechargeable wire-feed gassless mig welder given to me, I thought "cool"-the only thing is the batteries inside wont hold a charge I was told.
So without tring it since I figured the batts were dead and figued they knew what they were talking about, I took it apart and accessed the two 12 volt batteries.

They look just like a motorcycle 12 volt battery, but they are sealed, and so I can add water to recharge them or see how low the cells are, so anyway did a search on the battery part #, and found a site where they are $31.00 apiece, well that wouldnt be too bad for a good portable mig welder, but I also checked the a/c adapter that says it puts out 24V, and it accually puts out 32 or 36, my meter said a couple diff readings with it plugged in, so I was wondering if that would be ok to put out that many volts, or is that what killed the batteries?

any help would be appreciated, thanks in advance.

I'm going to take these two batteries and try to charge them somewhere since I dont have a charger (more $!) anyway, I'll let you all know if they hold a charge, but I'm doubting they will.
I'll check back for any replies, esp. about the adapter,
Thanks in advance.

John

[xj11john]

I meant "I can't add water" since the batts are sealed.

Also I searched the Matco Tools web site and others for several hours, and its discontinued, anyway the batteries are panasonic, and they are available, but high priced. The replacement ones I located were for that same OEM battery.

I havent looked into finding the adapted yet, but will do that next, I am just alittle concerned with spending too much on this thing since I dont know if what I buy-throwing parts or batteries at it will fix it or not.

I'm thinking after I find out about the batteries, or if motorcycle batteries would be ok to try (I'm thinking any 12 v batt should be fine, as long as it fits back inside, I should be ok)
that if an adapter with the right specs can be had fairly cheap I'll take a chance on it.

As I said any comments welcome. I have a pretty good idea that the adapter putting out that much voltage is what prob fried the batteries, and if so it just depends on what both an adapter and replacement batteries would cost if I even mess with this thing, if not then I'll have an old partster rechargeable mig welder laying around, oh well it was free
Thanks again,

[Dragonrider]

Well, I certainly wouldn't expect to get much bead time out of it, even with new batteries. Welding takes LOTS of energy. I'm surprised there is such a thing as a battery operated one.

That said...I would guess that the two batteries were wired in series...that would make the output from them 24 volts. A 24 volt charger should probably put out close to 30 volts to fully charge a 24 volt bank. Unloaded, it's anybody's guess...unloaded chargers often put out odd voltages.

So...if you've got some light welding projects, I'd give the batteries a shot. And yes, probably any 12 volt batteries in series would give the same result...but they need to be deep cycle would be my guess...

If the welder's very sophisticated it will cut off before they are totally dead...cycling batteries below 11v (60% discharged) absolutely KILLS their life/number of cycles/capacity.

[remccool]

If nothing else, you could go to wallyworld and get a cheap battery re-charger and just bypass built in charging system and charge the batteries individually. It seems to me that most rechargers I've seen run about 10% above the battery voltage. 36V seems way too high, but then I'm not and electrician.

[kf4anm]

sounds like you have a couple sealed lead acid's you stated they are 12 volts, what is the amp hour raing on them. do they have spade terminals or nut and bolt?

[mro]

pooting out

Charger Voltage???

Would think that would be something I would know.
Have repaired dozens of chargers over the years, 12/24/36 volt.
Never checked volt out put, just the amps.

can check tomorrow at work to see what kinda volts different chargers put out.

___________________

good quality deep cycle batteries have a life of 3 to 5 years IF taken care of. If not used they need to be charged at least monthly. Not charged after use will shorten life dramatically


mro

[xj11john]

You guys rock!

Thanks so much for the input all, sounds like the consensus is that my batteries are toast from either not being charged enough or just old, the welder had a service call sticker on it from '97 from Ohio, so I think just neglect. I'll swing by Wally World and check out chargers and battery price.

As I said they are the size of a motor cycle battery - yes they are 2-in series.

I will check on the prices, and first try to charge them individually or in series for longer, and then check their status, may be awhile due to the money issue.

Thanks again

[xj11john]

You guys rock!

Thanks so much for the input all, sounds like the consensus is that my batteries are toast from either not being charged enough or just old, the welder had a service call sticker on it from '97 from Ohio, so I think just neglect. I'll swing by Wally World and check out chargers and battery price.

As I said they are the size of a motor cycle battery - yes they are 2-in series.

I will check on the prices, and first try to charge them individually or in series for longer, and then check their status, may be awhile due to the money issue.

Thanks again

[xj11john]

The amp hour rating is :

20 hour- (850 mA)
10 hour- (1500 mA)
5 hour - (2600 mA)
1 hour- (10000 mA)

1.5 hour rate discharge

cut-off voltage 10.5V

Residual capasity after standing 12 months was 64%
6 months 82%, 3 months 91%

(I see what you guys mean about going dead sitting around!)

MRO, You were right on the money on 3-5 years, thats what they said (same as most batteries).

Kf4amn,

They have nut and bolt on each.

Later,

[kf4anm]

SLA

sounds like 2 lead acid 12v 18ah's in parallel making 24v from the size and terminals you describe. if so i retail them all the time at $59.99 each but would be glad to sell you a pair for $39.99 per battery plus ups ground.



lead acid when treated right can last upwards of 5 years. charge them after each use, never completely discharge, and don't leave them on the charger for extened periods of time.

[xj11john]

Thanks but that's alittle out of my price range, I'll check wal-mart for any old MC battery and come out cheaper, esp. with shipping charges, thanks anyway.

And since I dont know if the thing even works with good batteries, I'd stand to loose all that $.

Oh and I found some batteries that cross to the same panasonic # that mine have on-line for 31.00 plus shipping, still too high.

But, thanks anyway, I really appreciate it.

[kf4anm]

no problem.

to fix a goof i meant to say series - making 24v
parallel would just double your cap and leave 12v

if space is not an issue a couple wet bike batteries would work. just a little more maintenance with them.

good luck in getting it going.

ps what was your panasonic number?

[mro]

dont know if the thing even works

You can TEST it with any two 12V batts. Don't have to be same either. Could use your cage batt and your scoot.



MRO

[xj11john]

Mro,

thats what I was thinking also, may do that, its kinda back burner right now with the lawn mower and bike stuff-nice weather finally.

[xj11john]

kf4anm,

I believe it was LC-RD1217P (from the search i just did, Im at work )