Tools and cheeze whiz

[lvrsnr]

say newbie did you get your brakes fixed??? larry r and does cheeze whiz work as a dielectric ?

[Larrym]

Grease is the Word...The Word That I Heard..

Ok...Ummm.. I get that a lot of owners here Buy and Use "Die-Electric" Grease on the electrical connectors of their Bikes. Pardon me but my brain is running like a truck with square wheels on this subject: THWUMP!!

I've used the small tubes of Die-electric grease on the insulators/porcelain part of my spark plugs. The Idea as I understood it was that the grease was used to seal out moisture which would cause the plugs to misfire when 20 thousand volts found some moisture to follow. The grease in this case (Die-electric...) supposed to be non-conductive to prevent the same 20 thousand volts from using the grease itself to follow and therefore cause a misfire. After pulling the spark plug boots on and off a few times, the grease migrated to the actual metal connectors inside the boot and also to the spark plug metal. Result was that this grease then acted as a BARRIER to the 20 thousand volts and the plug failed to fire.

On the bikes here we're dealing with 12 volts, not 20 thousand. Yet owners are using die-electric grease. (KLUNK!!) Is the grease being applied to the outside of the connectors to prevent anything from "arcing and sparking" to ground or is the grease being applied/slathered on the actual mechanical contacts which electrons must travel across? From an electron's point of view I wouldn't want to have to make my way through a layer of non-conducting grease in order to get to my next connector.

What? Am I missing something Here??

[Geezer]

The dielectric grease is being used to keep air and water out of the connectors so those little brass terminals won't corrode...

Geezer

[tw1980]

I use a small amount of anti seize on my spark plug caps.It will withstand more heat.No resulting problems.

Terry

[XS1100 Newbie]

I did get my brakes fixed. No problems yet. Thanks for the concern.

[XS1100 Newbie]

Just a note about dielectric grease

Dielectric grease is also used for a heat sink compound on the old control modules on autos. I would say from all the uses i have seen, it is conductive, or at least does not interfere with the conections.

[Axel]

yes and no

I would argue with that only in that di-electric grease may conduct heat but not electricity

[Axel]

Confused - yes I was too

I have di-electric grease all over all my connections (including spark plug wires and caps) to keep moisture out and to prevent corrosion .This does not improve the connection , just allows it to stay good. The (copper ?) anti seize is a excellent conductor of electricity and is there fore good on battery and ground connections etc to ensure a continuous good connection and prevent corrosion and acid buildup or whatever .
I am cheap so I used Petrolium jelly instead of Copper anti sieze . I put a very small amount on the actual connection ,assemble and then put di-electric grease on the outside of said connection as a barrier and in the back of connector plugs .

[CatatonicBug]

Not sure what all the confusion is about on this topic. Dielectric grease does NOT conduct electricity. That is the definition of "Dielectric". It simply creates a barrier against moisture - preventing corrosion. When applied to a connector, it's usually best to apply AFTER the connection is made, so it does not interfere with the connection. However, if the connector is secure enough, the thin membrane that may remain between the mating surfaces does not usually cause an issue with the flow of electrons. If there is a location where there is no risk of coming in contact with another connector (i.e., a spark plug, ground connections), anti-sieze is the best choice, as it DOES conduct electircity, due to the metal infused in it.

Vaseline also does NOT conduct electricity, and has been used for years as a substitute for Dielectric grease, but it gets more viscous at higher temps, so it tends to run out of the connections, especially at the temps that a bike creates.

[fredintoon]

Um, ain't that LESS viscous at higher temps?

Not sure what all the confusion is about on this topic. Dielectric grease does NOT conduct electricity. - - - - -
Vaseline also does NOT conduct electricity, and has been used for years as a substitute for Dielectric grease, but it gets more viscous at higher temps, so it tends to run out of the connections, especially at the temps that a bike creates.

Hi 'Bug,
my understanding of how the greasing of terminals, battery posts etc. worked was that when the terminal was pushed or clamped together the grease was scraped or squeezed out of there to allow metal to metal contact for current flow. The grease then kept water from getting in there and growing little non-conducting corrosion crystals on the contact surfaces to impede the current flow.

[Axel]

State of Confusion

I guess I'm still confused but at least I dont think the vaseline did any harm the way I was using it . I will re-think that idea though . Seems there is some opposing ideas about it on the web and I didnt read too many of them last year when researching . I will keep it away from heat at any rate .

[Larrym]

Oil of Olay: Dielectric or Not?

I come from an electronics background so here I "know" what the definition of die-electric is according to the dictionary. (What is sold as die-electric grease may in fact be subject to marketing strategies and therefore not actually be a true "die-electric" ...I just dunno!!) Like in my previous post, the point of the dielectric grease I used was to act as a barrier to 20 thousand volts and actually kept the electricity from flowing when it migrated to the actual metal/electrical connections. I can't see applying that type of grease directly and purposefully to the metal parts of the spade/bullet connectors on my bike as "helping" the little electrons go about their merry way.

I agree that the grease does act as a barrier for oxygen/moisture which would accelerate any corrosion/rusting of the metal connectors and give us that, "Crap!! How come my lights/horn/starter isn't working??!!" But if that same grease can act as a barrier for 20K volts then a measely 12 volts is no problem at all. Sure, after one slathers the contacts and pushes the male/female together then there's gonna be some metal to metal contact for the electrons to find a path through. Just not as much as if the grease wasn't used at all. ( For a test of this effect, rub your palms together right now and get a feel for it. Next grab some of your girlfriends night cream and apply it to your palms. Rub your palms again and decide for yourself which one has better "contact.")

I live in a marine environment and have had my share of rusted/corroded connectors to deal with. I have actually put iron filings in regular grease and used that as a method to protect things from corrosion and to promote the flow of those little electron guys. (After cleaning the connections of course...)

Next time I'm at the parts store I'll put on my reading glasses and take a gander at those "dielectric" greases in tubes, bottles, and pressurized cheeze whiz dispensers. "Recommended Uses" should be quite a delightful read. Hopefully I'll find that these products aren't really "dielectric" cause otherwise I'd say putting it on those metal connections is like shooting your own self in the foot here.

(I mean like shooting all those electrons in their itty bitty feet and getting mad at them cause they can't run.)

[randy]

All good points, Larry. That's why I use 'copper grease' a mix of silicone and copper powder. I think it's also sold as 'anti-seize' in little envelopes at the parts counters.

Oh, maybe I should have read the above posts......

[randy]

Maybe it would help if I post the supplier of the stuff I use. I gave some of this away at the last two or three XSEast rallies. I swear by it, use it on all my connectors (except spark plugs). BTW, only use it in the female end or it will cause shorts, it's THAT conductive.

http://www.alternatorparts.com/Copper.htm

[tw1980]

I haven't been anywhere since college that I have seen so many electronics people in one place.(with the exception of a few tech schools)What is the attraction of these bikes to technical,engineer and electronic type people?In most places I feel like I'm the smartest guy in the room,(even smarter after a couple beers)but here I feel like I'm average at best.Why are there soooo many smart people on this forum?

Terry