it only gets better...

[Ivan]

On top of people shooting pellet guns at my house and dogs, last night I find the 7 month old "enhanced" septic system has failed. $10,000 out the door. It is supposed to have a three year warranty, but there is an exclusionary clause that the warranty is void if there is too much water use. I told them when they installed it to make darn sure it was big enough to handle our household.

We had to buy a used lawnmower, since the guy who usually cuts out grass on the cheap is always broke down, so there's another five bills gone.

Then last night, we start hearing this incessant drip outside the cardboard walls We haven't been able to scrape up the $30,000 we need to build extra bedrooms in the basement, so the wife and I sleep in a cardboard room to keep the kids comfortable in "proper" bedrooms. This morning, I find that we have about 50 feet of copper line that ruptures from the pressure of a finger. It is all corroded out and ready to burst open. The drip is from a pinhole leak spraying onto an adjacent pipe, or at least it was a pinhole leak.....

So now I am missing work to get crap fixed up around the house, just to get by.

We have already been through $2000 this week, and it looks like we are in for more.

I would much rather spend this on motorcycle stuff.

[Wildkat]

okay... so we don't have a septic system so I don't have a clue... but how do they prove too much water use? and I'm assuming by what you've said, that this is part of the problem and why it failed?

That sucks...
Sooo sorry

[tw1980]

Seems like when it rains it pours.Sorry you're having a run of bad luck.Just a thought:if you've been having a lot of wet weather there.My septic system used to slow down during wet spring weather when the kids lived a home.Then when things dried out a bit would work fine.It also helped when I put in a front load washer. Good luck with your repairs. Terry

[Ivan]

Well the point I was trying to make is that I have an 8 person family, and they should have designed the system to handle that load. If it failed because of too much water usage, it was a design flaw, not an over usage flaw. I don't know how to design or install septic systems, so I hired people to do it for me, and trusted them to do it right. I know that no one likes to have to redo a job, and usually home improvement contractors are the worst for trying to squirm out of backing their product.

Don't ask me about the new windows we are fighting over crappy installation with the contractor....

[CatatonicBug]

Just be glad you didn't take your bike to a mechanic! Then you'd be fighting with that too! At least you have that little piece of enjoyment...

If you want it done right, you've gotta do it yourself... Maybe there's a septic system forum out there somewhere??

[DGXSER]

Ivan, I'd bet dimes to donuts they designed the system based upon the sq footage of the house and maybe the number of bathrooms and sinks if they were smarter than the average idiots. Whoever sold you the system told you they would do whatever you asked them to do and then priced it based upon your house not your family because they knew if they priced what you wanted they would be higher than everyone else you got prices from. They guy at the office who picked the equipment to buy and install had no clue about your family size, he saw the price or the house size and said "This is what we sold them". And the installer just knew they had to put in what was on the truck. BTDT WAYY to many times. Unfortunately, the same thing happens in the commercial world to. Thats why I have my job making sure stuff does what the owner asked it to do before they pay up and finalize the project.

Look at your contract and see what they were to do, how specific was the job detailed?

[Ivan]

I talked directly to the owner of the operation and told him that I have an 8 person family and that it should be sized to fit. When the county health witch came out and told us we would have to have a mound the size of an ammo bunker in the back yard, I told her too, since she had to sign off on it before work could begin. We even had to get a waiver for a larger than normal system through the state. It was abundantly clear that we needed a bigger system, and I barked about it the whole time. Only thing is I have to take them at their word when I ask if it is the right size.

Anyhow the office gal at the contractor's office was at least pleasant with me and said she would get someone out here asap. Well, asap wasn't today...

Then I started in on the plumbing I had to do since my copper pipes were corroded through. After 8 solid hours of plumbing I finally had no more leaks. Filled the water heater back up and tried to light the fire....and tried again....and again....pilot wouldn't stay lit. So off to the hardware store for a new thermocouple...and tried again....and again....damnit. I got to looking around and the stupid pipes had dripped all over the control unit and corroded the back side of it. I am guessing it somehow messed up the valve or I let it run when it was drained, not sure. Either way a new controller was going to be over half the price of a new unit and two weeks away. Not really an option to get along for two weeks with no hot water. So down to the retailers to get a new water heater.

So now I have no resolution on the septic system and I am sure I flooded the thing several times over since I was doing so much leak checking. My sump was going nearly all day. But, I do have a new 50 gallon heater and plastic pipe that won't corrode.

There's an up side to this whole series of events. Not sure if I will ever figure out what the hell it is but there is one.

[DGXSER]

You probably already know this Ivan, but if copper pipes are corroding like that, it is typically due to galvanic corrosion from dissimilar metals being connected without a brass or dielectric fitting. Sounds like you may nto have much of the original piping left anyway, but just thought I'd put that out there so you don't wind up just moving the point of corrosion around a bit.

[XJOK2PLAY]

Ivan,

Just wanted to say I'm really sorry to hear your havin' the kind of luck I thought only I had...always!

One day at a time, one step at a time...hang in there, it's gotta get better.

[Crazcnuk]

I assume your on a well, since you are using a septic system. If the PO tried to 'shock' the well, with the wrong chemicals, it also eats copper piping, really fast.

Septic systems are just a tank with pipes that radiate out, so I would ask what part failed? On ours the pump can go, but that is about the only 'moving' part in the whole unit.

I don't know about the laws in your area, but here, in the Sales of Goods act, it states that if you rely on the vendor's expertise THEY are responsible for the unit working, so talk to your BBB and any local/state trades listing services where they don't want to get a bad name.

[Wildkat]

There's an up side to this whole series of events. Not sure if I will ever figure out what the hell it is but there is one.

Here's one:

But, I do have a new 50 gallon heater and plastic pipe that won't corrode

and it looks like you'll have some more new stuff to go with it pretty soon... and hopefully, it will last long enough for you to get your money's worth from it...

Hoping today goes better...

[egleaves]

Ivan, as a plumber I've installed miles of copper water line and what a couple of people said previously is correct, copper pipes corroding that bad is an indication of a larger problem. You may have fixed the active leak(s), but unless you identify and correct what caused such advanced corrosion it's gonna happen again. Personally I'm against plastic water lines, but certain situations sometimes call for certain materials so do what you gotta do.

[Ivan]

I am guessing the copper corroded because it was 45+ years old and our water is very alkaline. I am also guessing there is a bit of sulphur in it as much of the corrosion had the brilliant bluish color of copper sulfate. On top of that, our water is hard enough to make bricks, so the dissimilar metal could be the calcium in the water. I looked it over really well, and there were no other metals than copper, unless the solder counts, but the corrosion wasnt at the joints.

I chose PVC because it is cheap and easy to work with. Also, the hot water side was OK and is still copper. If money wasnt such an issue, I wouldd have used Weirsbo and been done with it.

Modern septic systems aren't merely a tank and laterals. The EPa got involved and now we have to have "Enhanced" systems. These consist of a normal cistern, followed by a processing tank that has an airpump attached to bubble air through the black water. After this, the EPA says that you cant put the leech field any closerr than 4 feet to seasonal high water. Since it flooded the year before, I now have a 5 foot mound for a leech field. There is a lift station to pump the grey water up to it. The failure came because the contractor didnt put enough cover soil on top of the laterals. Over the winter, snow and rain eroded through and the effluent found its way out thee side. I also suspect they didnt break up the old hard pan created from the previous field, so the effluent couldnt percolate to ground water. It would have been nice if they had put down some sort of barrier to keep the erosion down, but they didnt.

I am ready to sell the house and rent it....

[DiverRay]

The failure came because the contractor didnt put enough cover soil on top of the laterals. Over the winter, snow and rain eroded through and the effluent found its way out thee side. I also suspect they didnt break up the old hard pan created from the previous field, so the effluent couldnt percolate to ground water. It would have been nice if they had put down some sort of barrier to keep the erosion down, but they didnt.

This sounds like a lawsuit to me. At least a talk with the contractors board, if your State has one. NOT doing a proper job, when that IS your job, is not something I would pay for twice.

[foreda]

1-800- Suit

1-800- sue the hell out of em!!
Better Business Bureau??