My First Post

[Trainzz]

Just wanted to drop a Mid-Kansas "Howdy" to everyone. For the first time in 15 years, I am able to get my knees back in the breeze. Thanks to craigslist and a reasonable seller, I now own a 1980 XS11 Special that actually runs. I also picked up a 1980 that will run (hopefully) by next spring, and a 1978 that will supply a couple of parts. I am looking forward to reading up on all the info about these bikes, as I have no experience with Yamaha's at all. Ah well, it is the empty sponge that gathers the most water.

Lee (aka trainzz)

[Wildkat]

Welcome aboard

Man! Didn't waste any time jumping into it, did you?
3 of them?
that's a bit XSive... you'll fit right in here...

[CatatonicBug]

Welcome to the forum!! You lucked out getting a running bike. Of course, you really lucked out having 3 whole bikes!! Feel free to ask any questions you might have, as there is a huge wealth of informaiton available here. Lots of people with years of intimate experience with these bikes, and all are very willing to help get another XS running, tuned and roaring down the road. If you need a service manual, I have both the OEM and the Clymers versions hosted on my website. Of course, pictures are always appreciated!

[fredintoon]

For the first time in 15 years, I am able to get my knees back in the breeze. Thanks to craigslist and a reasonable seller, I now own a 1980 XS11 Special that actually runs. I also picked up a 1980 that will run (hopefully) by next spring, and a 1978 that will supply a couple of parts. I am looking forward to reading up on all the info about these bikes, as I have no experience with Yamaha's at all. Lee (aka trainzz)

Hi Lee and welcome,
If you haven't ridden for 15 years fer Chrissake take a rider's course.
Especially as you will be riding a massive top-heavy bike with the power to go way over 100mph coupled with brakes and steering that are kinda iffy when the bike gets past 85. Some pointers:- They all shift like a Russian tractor. Even with a full gas tank a Special can't go much over a hundred miles past a gas pump. If you are in search of used parts, lotsa Yamaha parts swap like LEGO between years and models.

[lakecountrydave]

Welcome! Congrats on your "new" bikes. Don't forget to post some pictures

[cywelchjr]

Hi Lee and welcome,
If you haven't ridden for 15 years fer Chrissake take a rider's course.
Especially as you will be riding a massive top-heavy bike with the power to go way over 100mph coupled with brakes and steering that are kinda iffy when the bike gets past 85. Some pointers:- They all shift like a Russian tractor. Even with a full gas tank a Special can't go much over a hundred miles past a gas pump. If you are in search of used parts, lotsa Yamaha parts swap like LEGO between years and models.

I would certainly not want to jump right only an XS11 right off after that long. After 13 years off, I rode for a year on my XS400 before pulling the trigger on an XS11, and I'm glad I did. I got back used to proper riding technique, and back to things being reflexive (like riding a bicycle it doesn't go away). However, I had about 15000 miles over about 300 days of riding before I got the 11, and it still took me some getting used to (stripped down basic XS400 to full dress XS11 is a big difference, I really see it when they are parked side by side).

Dropped the 11 twice in the first 2 weeks I had it (both times going up the curb into my driveway) before I got to where I really understood the balance, got it second nature (except for the fat *ss with the Vetter hard bags I just put on, having a hard time getting used to where they are, since I can't seem them from the saddle). Now if I could just stop scraping the back of SWMBO's car and the back of my daughter's Camaro when pulling to the driveway I would be good (although it wouldn't be such a problem if they would just keep the cars on the street and leave the driveway/carport for the bikes as should be).

[tarzan]

Welcome, you dont ease into things do you?lol

[xs11lover]

Welcome, Way to go. It took me years before I had three. I'd bet you still have half the $ into it that most new age bikers do. Everyone here is happy to help. Fire when ready. The 80sg is my favorite one.

[Trainzz]

Thanks for the welcome, ya'll. My total outlay for the three bikes was $2000.
God bless craigslist. Only one is rideable at this point. The second 1980 is getting stripped down to bare frame for a full dress restoration. Along with the bikes themselves. I also got fairings, hard saddlebags and two extra seats. The guy I bought these from basically emptied out his garage (impending wedding and SWMBO said he had too much stock).
I did a rider safety/refresher course in March (required in KS to get a license), and have logged approx 2000 miles since then.
I love my special. True, it shifts like a Mongolian earth mover. And stopping every 100 miles for petrol is no problem, it just gives my old bones a chance to walk around and stretch. It certainly doesn't turn on a dime.
But every time I go to the local dealer, or pull into the Sonic for a coke, other riders (including Harley fanatics) come over to check it out.
I will be posting pictures this weekend. I should be able to squeeze that in between the benefit poker run Saturday and the trip to the in laws Sunday.
The weather is getting nicer and I can wait for this summer.

Cheers!

[gene]

How do you post in repairs?

[CatatonicBug]

How do you post in repairs?

You don't. Think of that area like a user manual. If you have questions or comments, post them out here. The repairs area is just stuff that the admins of this site have collected and decided that they were good enough to save and share to the masses.

[gene]

Has anyone taken apart the final drive? I want to powder coat the part, but 400 degrees will probably damage the seals. Plus everything Ive taken apart on this bike is a mess.

[DJinNH]

Has anyone taken apart the final drive? I want to powder coat the part, but 400 degrees will probably damage the seals. Plus everything Ive taken apart on this bike is a mess.

I've got to say, I admire a new owner of one of these old bikes who is willing to put so much work into making them look new again. Good job and good luck.

Don

[gene]

I've got to say, I admire a new owner of one of these old bikes who is willing to put so much work into making them look new again. Good job and good luck.

Don

Thanks Don, Too easy to buy a new one. This bike is a tribute to my Dad. I need to start posting photos. Its all apart and going to the powder coaters this morning. Plating parts are next.

Gene

[3Phase]

A Few Final Drive Details

Has anyone taken apart the final drive? I want to powder coat the part, but 400 degrees will probably damage the seals. Plus everything Ive taken apart on this bike is a mess.

Hello, Gene, welcome to the site! Wow, I didn't know there was a new member down in Corona. I was down in Corona yesterday making yet-another parts run for my bike. I completely understand what you mean when you say that everything you've taken apart on your bike is a mess.


Anyway, to answer your first question: yes, I've taken apart a couple of Yamaha final drives and put them back together. To answer your next question: yes, they still work. They don't run hot; they don't rumble, whine or growl; they don't click, clack, clank or clunk and they don't leak oil.

To answer your second question: no, 400 degrees Fahrenheit isn't going to be good for the seals or any oil remaining in the drive. You can disassemble the final drive, clean and powder coat the housing, then put it all back together. It's not too difficult but it is time-consuming. Be careful and pay attention or you'll have a nicely powder-coated paperweight to use while you shop around for another final drive.

Hopefully, you have a service manual -- Chilton's or the Yamaha factory service manual for your bike and you will be able to locate a copy of the old Yamaha publication LIT-11616-77-01, "Yamaha Shaft Drive Service Manual XS750 Models." They are both necessary.

To give you some idea of what you're trying to do when you take apart and reassemble the final drive, here's a final drive diagram from Yamaha and a numbered list of o-rings, seals, gaskets, the expansion spacer (crush washer) and so on. The expansion spacer (crush washer) is important.

Item	Part#			Description		Reqiured

7	93210-58346-00	O-RING	 			1

10	93101-38086-00	OIL SEAL				1

12	1J7-46129-Y1-00	SPACER, EXPANSION		1

22	93101-30084-00	OIL SEAL				1

24	93211-44348-00	O-RING				1

27	93102-70167-00	OIL SEAL (93102-70166)		1

31	214-11198-01-00	GASKET				2

32	93210-14359-00	O-RING				1

First, drain the oil from the final drive and remove the final drive from the bike.

Look at the picture. Do you see nut #13? Do not remove nut #13. If you remove nut #13 you will have to put it back on and check the bearing preload while you set the torque on nut #13.

Leave Nut #13 alone and remove screw #34.

Removing screw #34 will allow you to remove the entire input pinion assembly from the Drive Shaft Housing, Item #2.

Put the assembly in a clean box and be careful not to damage Item #17. It's a precision shim and you do not want to re-shim the input pinion shaft. Do not mix up or lose any of the parts. Look at the diagram and make sure you have removed all of the parts.

Next, remove all ten of nut #25 and carefully remove Bearing Housing #23.

Be careful not to damage any of the seals or o-rings while you remove the ring gear and the bearings and do not lose or damage Thrust Washer #21 or Ring Gear Shim #28.

Put all of the parts in a clean box, in order, and do not lose or mix up any of the parts.

You really should replace seal #22, seal #27 and o-ring #24 while the final drive is off the bike and disassembled but the cost of new seals and o-rings can exceed the cost of an entire used final drive that already has a decent coat of factory paint on it.

Now you can clean and powder coat the empty Drive Shaft Housing, Item #2, without baking the seals and filling the oven with stinky gear oil smoke.


Assembly is the reverse of disassembly.

Ideally, you should be able to drop the ring gear, bearings, shims, etc. back into the freshly-powder-coated Drive Shaft Housing, then install the pinion assembly with some Yamalube #4 sealer between shim #17 and both housings, then tighten screw #34.

If you accidentally (or for some other reason) remove nut #13, here are the specifications for a Type 2 XS1100 Final Drive.

Type 2 Bearing Preload:
4 -5 cm-kg (3.4 - 4.3 in-lb)

Nut #13 Tightening Torque (reference):
10 ~ 15 m-kg (72 ~ 108 ft-lb)

Basically, you tighten nut #13 to about 40 ft-lb, then try to turn Item #11, the Gear Coupling, by hand or with a torque wrench on nut #13 to check the pinion bearing preload.

Tighten nut #13 a little bit at a time until the bearing preload is correct. Nut #13 should require about 70 ~ 75 ft-lb, the lower end of the torque specification, as the Expansion Spacer (crush washer) has already been crushed when the final drive was assembled at the factory.

You will need a very fine hand or a very expensive torque wrench to measure 3.4 to 4.3 inch pounds of bearing preload and it can be difficult to set the torque correctly without ruining the Expansion Spacer (crush washer). Don't try to use a 'click' type torque wrench to check bearing preload.

If you over-torque nut #13 and over-crush the Expansion Spacer, bearing preload will be too tight. The Expansion Spacer (crush washer), Item #12 ,is still available from Yamaha.

Don't try to loosen nut #13 if you over-torque it to try to correct for too much pinion bearing preload.

The Expansion Spacer (crush washer) will have been crushed too far and it's not reversible. If you just loosen nut #13 it won't hold under load and the entire assembly will loosen up and try to come apart while you ride.

The Expansion Spacer (crush washer) will have to be replaced and nut #13 torqued again while checking the bearing preload. A new Expansion Spacer (crush washer) will have to be torqued toward the upper torque limit, closer to ~85 to 90 ft-lb,as the new Expansion Spacer will have to be crushed to set the bearing preload correctly.


Re-shimming and setting the pinion depth, checking ring and pinion gear engagement, backlash and bearing preload is not a lot of fun if you don't have to do it. If you're just repainting the final drive housing, don't remove nut #13.


Regards,

Scott