Just wondering...

[trbig]

"I don't know where you got that 6000 = 120.......?"


It was 6500.. and that's what was listed.

pggg, I have seen many postings that show you are VERY against the 750 Final Drive swap. I think I remember you saying you have done it in the past (if I remember right...) but you are honestly the ONLY person I know of that didn't like it.

I don't know how many have actually done this swap, but you are definately in the extreme minority on your opinion of it. I've got several thousand miles on mine and it looks just like it did when we put it in. If for some reason this drive does go out, I will pay money and buy another 750/850 drive to put in versus using the 1100 drives I already own. I'll never go back to them. I personally think it's THE best thing I have ever done for this motor and bike for longevity.... except changing oil.. lol.


Tod

[pggg]

Trbig, I actually really don't care two hoots one way or the other how anyone gears their bike it's just that sluggish over-geared old fogie style bikes don't interest me, but after all this time I still haven't heard anyone agree on what revs/speed the 750 drive actually gives. All I'm getting is conflicting information, I know from my chaindrive ratios that dropping any more than 400 revs from stock is a backward step rather than an improvement, if the 750 drive does drop only 300 - 400 revs, then I'd call it a perfect gearing mod, but no-one here seems to be able to give me the REAL numbers... the truth won't hurt you know fellas ... Also, if doing, say, 3000@ 50mph, then you MUST be doin' 6000@ 100mph!! What's hard to understand about that?? Yes, looks like Patrick's right again, I can see I'm gonna have to give you lot some tuition on mathematics..

[trbig]

it's just that sluggish over-geared old fogie style bikes don't interest me,

Then what are you doing in here? In it's best days the 11 only ran in the high 11's in the 1/4 mile. By today's standards, we ALL have sluggish old fogie styled bikes. With a ton of work and money, you may even be able to get one to go into the 10 second range. Congratulations... you just made it into what most current 600cc bikes will do.

My rpm's dropped by 7-800 rpms at 70mph. I still do wheelies on a launch if desired. The motor doesn't lug and I don't slip the clutch much at all to get going when taking off easy. The only time I even really notice a change is taking off from stopped going uphill steeply with two up.

I will and have on many occasions run this bike with this setup against other stock bikes. The people I beat off the line OR from a roll on.. and myself... don't quite understand what you mean by sluggish even though I outweigh them normally. I have a much more complete feeling first gear now. It doesn't feel like a granny gear that's done after 10mph like stock, and this is where it excells. I'm still running it up in the power band when they are having to shift.

Cody tried to talk to you about this and it didn't do any good then. I don't see that I am going to change your mind either. I just don't understand why everybody else loves this mod tremendously and even though everyone is telling you there isn't really much change performance-wise... you clearly don't want to hear it.

[MAXIMAN]

Originally posted by pggg
Trbig, I actually really don't care two hoots one way or the other how anyone gears their bike it's just that sluggish over-geared old fogie style bikes don't interest me, ...

Oh really?

THEN WHY ARE YOU CONSTANTLY REPLYING TO THESE THREADS?! TROLL!

If this is such a poor gear choice...then how have I slapped the living shiite out of every bike I've done the "two step tango" with Patrick? If this is geared to tall...then how is it everytime I speed shift from second to third ...this overgrown "wing" of an Eleven lofts the front wheel?

I only wished you were in the states....I would LOOOOOVE to settle this on the asphalt once and for all. But alas... I think that is why you talk so much trash around here because you're thousands of miles away and safe from being utterly humiliated. Of course you're doing a damn fine job of that with many of your posts.

In exploration/production we have a term for people like you Patty..."High pressure...Low volume" ...of course I doubt you'll ever figure it out.

By the way for the rest of you good people that are "truly" interested in this most XSellent modification, Zilla now has right at 10,000 miles on this 750 drive with no problem.

Bohn Frazier hit the proverbial nail on the head after he installed his 750 drive and rode 5000 miles on the "Oregon Trail" with me. He said "This is the way this bike should've been geared from the factory!"

(...sorry for pulling punches folks. I just have a little problem telling people what I REALLY THINK!)

[DiverRay]

pggg,
On a friendlier note, I think the big difference is the roads we ride here. We DO have some nice twisty roads to ride, but also must cover hundreds of miles on a "superslab". If I was living and riding in your location, I think I would have to agree with you. If you DO NOT run flat open freeways for hundreds of miles, there is no need for the mod. As I commute over a "hill", 1,800' up and down, every day, I can see both sides of this. I DO run the 750 mod on my '79 standard, and for me it works. I was able to get over 50 MPG on the trip from South Lake Tahoe to San Francisco, running the speed limit plus a few. This WAS with the group, on our way to Oregon, so we were all running loaded.
On my commute, I now have to shift to fourth if I want the extra "punch" passing a car going up the hill. My bike is NOT like Maximans, in that it is stock, with about 95K on the engine.
Maximan, need to watch the blood pressure!! lets keep the "personal" stuff out of here. We ALL have opinions, and I know your dad told you about them!!

[BrianB]

I just purchased an XS100SG just over a month ago. Mine seems geared a tad tall in first gear. How would I be able to tell if I was equiped with this Mod?

[fredintoon]

Ad hominem? Tsk Tsk

"In exploration/production we have a term for people like you Patty..."High pressure...Low volume" ...of course I doubt you'll ever figure it out."

Hi Maximan,
from context I do believe you are trying to insult the man? While in (presumably oil) production HPLV is not desirable, in a braking system's hydraulics it's exactly what is needed so in NZ it may be taken for a compliment.
AND, you didn't answer the question. As I understand the modification one swaps in an XS750 rear wheel bevel box (and yes I do know they ain't bevels but some kinda epi-fancy thing) in place of the stocker. So don't just make mock, count the teeth and publish the numbers.

[MAXIMAN]

No Fred...you're making this waaayyy to complicated. Since you didn't get it either I'll spell it out for ya.

It's just another way of saying "All blow and no go". But it shouldn't surprise me that "brakes" would be an big issue with Patty. He's constantly throwing the "brakes" on these final drive threads. Go figure.

AND I didn't answer what question...FRED? Speed at the specified RPM question FRED?

YES...I DID .... FRED. Unless you can't read. I even provided a standard gear reduction equation.

As far as the gear teeth are concerned...FRED...that is a mtter of public record. All you have to do is google the info. But since you seem not to understand how to use a search engine...FRED...I'll spoon feed you the numbers....this time only....FRED.

XS750 final gear case:

Type: Bevel
Teeth: 32/11
Ratio: 2.909 (for those of you who can't divide)

Of course I'm sure you're aware the final speed via rpm is dictated by tire O.D....and we are not real sure what Tod is running. I think Avon's...but I'm not sure.

Regardless...at 7500 rpm ...an estimate of 134 will be very close.

RAY:

Maximan, need to watch the blood pressure!! lets keep the "personal" stuff out of here. We ALL have opinions, and I know your dad told you about them!!

You know me better than that. The only thing that raises my blood pressure in a real since is some jackazz trying to stuff me on the Golden Gate. Besides all this discourse in good fun! mwahahahahahahaha!

[MAXIMAN]

Originally posted by DiverRay
pggg,
If I was living and riding in your location, I think I would have to agree with you. If you DO NOT run flat open freeways for hundreds of miles, there is no need for the mod. As I commute over a "hill", 1,800' up and down, every day, I can see both sides of this. I DO run the 750 mod on my '79 standard, and for me it works.

As can I.

If you recall...the very first time I published the instructions for this mod I stated unless you are pre-occupied with 1/4 mile times this mod would be a good option. Never have I calimed if you stay with stock gearing you are "under geared". I've never belittled anyone for NOT opting for this mod. I have promoted this mod XStensively because I feel it is a excellent way to drop the revs on your motor and increase fuel economy.

On the other hand belittlement is all we get (it seems) from Patty. If you do this mod it's a grave mistake. If you do this mod...you won't be able to climb your drive way two up...you're rear wheel will fall off and your mother will loose all her hair.


Besides...the 23 miles of gut wrenching hairpins north of Ft. Bragg...the 750 FD mod didn't seem to slow you nor I down one iota.

[MAXIMAN]

Originally posted by fredintoon
Most bikes will go faster with the tranny one gear below the highest even when geared stock and the 750 final drive just exaggerates the phenomenon.

This statement is most puzzling...even comical....MOST BIKES? What does that mean?

I can tell you for certain on "most" of my bikes this is not and has not been the case.

Allow me if you will.

I can take my ZRX to redline (10,500) in 4th gear. It is indicating 145 mph at that point.

In fifth I have wrapped the motor to 9000 rpm. The speedo was indicating 170 ...but it is optimistic. Gear reduction calcs indicate and actual speed of about 163 mph.

In any case the ZRX will get nowhere near top speed in 4th.

Your argument is probably valid with regard to the Eleven....the [b]stock[b] Eleven. But with just a bit more "juice" it falls apart like a dead grasshopper. All the re-geared Eleven needs (as with any bike) to reach a higher speed is more power to push it.

But then this final drive mod has very little to do with "top speed" for most of us...and much more to do with relaxing the engine at highway speeds and optimizing fuel economy.

So to say "most bikes" will reach top speed in one gear below top gear is somewhat of a mis-characterization. Maybe you should've said "some" bikes.

[malber]

Originally posted by BrianB
I just purchased an XS100SG just over a month ago. Mine seems geared a tad tall in first gear. How would I be able to tell if I was equiped with this Mod?

It's a relatively new mod. If the PO isn't on these boards he probably hadn't heard about it. It's a relatively complicated (though apparently bolt-on) procedure and involves purchasing a spare XS750 final drive. Your seller probably wouldn't have done this if he was planning on selling the bike, so I'd say it's unlikely that you have the mod if you didn't do it yourself.

[MAXIMAN]

Originally posted by fredintoon
Hi trbig,
there ain't no wall, at least not a new one. With the 750 final drive you effectively have a 3 speed tranny with two overdrives. When in the new 5th gear the motor just don't have the power to push the bike any faster. Most bikes will go faster with the tranny one gear below the highest even when geared stock and the 750 final drive just exaggerates the phenomenon.

Exaggerates WHAT phenomenon? Are you saying the stock geared Eleven will reach top speed in 4th? Not even close...the stock gearing will only reach 116 at redline. And we know the bike will go faster than that.

[mason79]

i thought the most wear an engine gets is from a dry cold start-up

when the bearings are floating on oil when running, wear is different and less than start-up.

and besides i'm trying to break and wear my eleven out, darn things.... made to run, yeah i bought a 750 final but never got the spacer to put it in, it's still nagging me a little but i guess i don't want to get that dirty and to pull the rear wheel again, christ... i pulled it for a tire change for ta-hole. christ i went through the whole darn bike, you name it,i did it, second gear is fine tho knock on lumber.

maybe someday i'll try it, heck even though it's a full dress, i'l like to think with the lower stock gearing, it is a street fighter- power cruiser if you will.

everytime i ride the darn thing, and i roll-on, i squirt right into a hole in the freeway even after the cage has been thinkin the same thing a few seconds earlier, i know you guy's says theres' no roll on differences with or without the mod, but i can't help but think...hmmm???

yeah my bike sings a high pitch, but like i said i don't want to get dirty and i'm trying to wear it out....

[fredintoon]

"This statement is most puzzling...even comical....MOST BIKES? What does that mean?"

Hi Max,
it don't puzzle me any (although admittedly I wrote it) and although you can't see it, I ain't laughing.
By "most bikes" It means the bone stock with perhaps some cosmetic changes but otherwise unmodified bikes that most people ride.
You may note that the ads for certain Japanese cruisers even admit to it,
touting their transmissions as having "five speeds plus an overdrive."

[MAXIMAN]

Fred with those profound words ...you are on the verge of Guruhood!