I know how to pick 'em

[thewiz]

I finally got the bike together 2 days ago ... fired it up ... ran for a few seconds and didn't sound right. Little bit of checking ... no compression in 1 and 4 ... more troubleshooting .... turns out that the shop that assembled the head and set the valve lash placed the shims under the bucket instead of on top. I never noticed. Destroyed the 79 cams and buckets and I don't know what else yet. Metal shavings everywhere.

It gets better, disgusted but not angry, I called the shop owner who told me, after I explained the problem, that the guy who did the work and wrote the ticket stole the money, deleted the electronic record of the transaction and left the state. Geez, nice ,eh?. I finally found my handwritten RO and convinced the shop owner that I did have work done there. Whew .. He was pretty nice after that .... has agreed to fix it all .... I trailered the bike over to him to get started. Time will tell.

Does anyone have an idea what kinds of damage, other than the obvious, may have occurred? I didn't do any cyl leak down testing before dropping it off to him. I'm kinda' thinking that the shop wants to replace the complete head, cams and buckets and all. Sad to lose a set of 79 cams though as I'm thinking they'll be hard to find. Andreas has a good head at a fair price.

[DiverRay]

The engine will have to be rebuilt COMPLETELY!! That is the ONLY way to rid it of the metal shavings. I would NOT have taken the bike back, but would have asked for ALL my money back, and looked for a new shop.

[mro]

Hey wiz...

Bummer.....

Cylinder walls, rings/pistons could be toast.
Will need to completely disassemble engine, inspect all bearings/journals etc. Spray clean and check with a magnet for hard to see particles.

If only ran for a few seconds tranny/clutch should be ok, but still need to be checked and cleaned.

Too bad your so far away, could use the work.


mro

btw, there's some un-shielded ball bearings in the lower end.

[thewiz]

What do you think is a fair price to pay for a good used motor? Maybe I'll start lookin' .... fix this one later ???

[mason79]

there is a complete runner on ebay in pico rivera, ca maybe you could get that one cheap, it's a 79f

[fredintoon]

Take a chance?

Hi Wiz,
If the shop owner is offering you a freebie or a reduced cost fix he's going in the hole bigtime to save his reputation. Fixing that motor will cost the shop a great deal more than will saying "sorry" and giving you the cylinder head fix money back. Get the bike back in good running condition and you are streets ahead. I doubt you'll agree to pay out another single red cent unless it's fixed right so get it back still fritzed and WTF you've lost nothing but the time you're without the bike.
You hafta go with your assessment on whether or not you can trust the guy.
Take a chance on a shop owner trying to rebuild his rep &/or take a chance on buying a used engine from a stranger?
Fred Hill, S'toon.

[79XS11F]

Good grief That sucks. OK .. if the shop owner is ready to make things right I would suggest to him that he replace the complete engine with a used one that is in good running order at reasonably similar mileage. I say this because You don't want to start mixing up parts from one head to another and even if a complete head is used he still would need to re and re all the side covers and oil pan in search of the metal bits that may be floating around in your engine. There is also the chance that there is other unseen damage. By the time he buys all the required gaskets, a used head, labor and shop incidentals he will be better off and so will you. I would however also tell him that you want your timing side guts and any other parts that would be good if the replacement engine proves to be unreliable.You will be receiving an "unknown" engine as compared to your "known" engine.
Rob

[wingnut]

Wiz, If it only ran for a few seconds than I doubt the metal shavings had time to get very far. With the head off a good flush with varsaw followed by cheap motor oil with the filter and galley plugs off should take care of that worry. Take a look at the tops of the pistons when the shop get the head off. No impact marks, no damage to the bottom end. Head is most likely shot if the cams are already messed up. I have a set of 79 cams of unknown quality, yours for the shipping if you want them.


Dave

[thewiz]

decision time

Well, I did it. I scrounged a motor from a guy who had an XS advertised that I looked at last summer. I didn't like the bike but, while looking, he also showed me a motor that he said he cut out of a junkyard wreck to get for himself. I emailed him and we got together on it. The odometer of the wreck read 7K thirteen yrs ago when he got it. Still had the oil in it. While not without a few minor issues, it appears that the motor has never been opened.

Bike shop owner was relieved and happy to solve it that way and judging by the other scooters in the shop, I think he will do a fine job. He doesn't know it yet, but I don't think I'll make him pay anything even though he's offered .... instead; get him to trade me for other services ... for example; he has a big parts cleaning tank ... stock of shims, carb jets, discounts etc. ... all of which will be helpful in the future ... cuz I ain't done fixin' up XSs .... of that much, I'm certain. I'll be starting with the motor he's pullin' out. He's to check the compression first, then stick the replacement back into the frame and get it runnin' again. Can any of you think of anything specific to this motor or motorcycles in general (as opposed to cars), aside from the ordinary, that should be done to this motor before installing or starting?

He said it would be done by the wknd .... so we'll see. Thank you for all of your input, it was invaluable in helping me decide how to handle what happened ..... without it, things may have gotten even worse ... instead they're gettin' better.

[DiverRay]

It's always good when you can work with the shop. We all make mistakes now and then, and to have him try to work with you seems fair to me. As you said, it will work out for both of you. Win Win is always good.

[thewiz]

That's right, Ray ... I can't forget that I should have noticed that the shims were not present when I put the head on too .... so I share some of the responsibility.

The shop owner told me it had been a month of similar $hit caused by this former employee .... so time will tell. I'm gettin' another bike, an F with a few mods, while I wait .... I'll try to get some pics up.