Looking for "Concrete" answers!

[TopCatGr58]

Dear fellow Xsives,

Another project looms on my horizon, and I come here with hat in hand looking for your collective sage advice!!

SWMBO wants "her" garage back! So...I am planning on buiding a shed beside the house to put my Hobby Work stuff into.

I have estimated that I will want about a 10' x 12' SHED. I may park Godzilla in it, but mostly for my machining tools and such. I want it to have a concrete floor due to the weight of my combo lathe/mill/drill=400+ lbs and other toys.

I have calculated that at that size and 3" deep, I would need appx. 1 cubic yard of concrete. I've never worked with concrete before!

QUESTIONS:
1) Is the thickness I have set proper for the weight and intended use: Machine and possibly bike, etc. plus shed?

2) If volume of concrete at 1 Cu. Yd is correct, can I mix this myself, possibly renting a rotary mixer, and be able to pour it, smooth, float,etc. by myself, and save $$$ vs. getting a truck to deliver and pour it?

3) Would it need a wire mesh in the bottom for reinforcing?

I plan on building the SHED also, will post other questions in another thread about that, but I should be able to fit the framing supports INTO the newly poured concrete, right?

ThanXS Xsively in advance.
T.C.

[DiverRay]

TC,
I would plan on 4" with wire for the floor. If you need permits for the shed, check into the local codes. If you can build the shed slightly larger(room?), it may be easier to fit all the toys, and any "new" ones that find their way home.
I don't know what the shed construction will be, but if it is going to be "bolted" to the concrete, then you may want a "footing" around the edge. This would be a space about 6" wide, and 6" deep on the perimeter of the shed floor, to hold the weight of the building. You will probably need about two or three yards of concrete, and a truck would be the fast and easy way. With just a 4" floor, you may be able to get one or two trailers of "haul your own" from a local yard. They are usually cheaper than trying to rent the machine and mixing it yourself.
I've done it both ways, and the best is with a beer as someone else does the work.
Ray

[Brian_D]

It has been over 20+ years since I worked with concrete so ...

1. Don't recall the concrete calculator math but I would go to a 4" depth with an additional footer around perimeter. here is a link to a Concrete Calculator

2. The largest portable mixer I've seen is approx 1/3 yard - so theoretically, yes you could mix yourself but would need to make first mix "wetter". In the end, I would probably have the concrete delivered by truck, then straight edge, float, and trowel myself. At 10' wide, it will be easier to straight edge with a 2nd person on other side of board.

3. Definitely will need reinforcement in pour. If using wire, rent a come-along - it will have the topside hook to reach into the pour and grap the wire - making it easier to pull more to center of pour.

I'm sure you'll get more descriptive replies and better info from others here..

[80mdnt11]

TC, Haven't got much creat exp.,however bro-in-law does & will be over later. Will ask him. Do know enough that you will need at least 4" deep with wire mesh. As for all your'e projects, try doityourself.com I have used it as referance on past projects of my own. Hope this helps.
So much time & so little to do! Oh, wait! Reverse that!

[Ken Talbot]

You're going to need footings under your perimeter walls, and your local building code will tell you how deep they will need to be to get below frost line. For a good introduction to wood frame construction, check out this site . For example, the link to foundations will give you an idea where to start.

And no, you don't put framing supports into freshly poured concrete!

[Ken Talbot]

Hey, just for the fun of it, here's one of the designs I have been playing with for a shed for my backyard. Similarly, SWMBO wants me and my tool out of the room in the basement so she can move her winemaking equipment and wine cellar into that area. I've been working on a concept that includes an open, sheltered section under the same roofline as the main work area.

Plan view:


Framing view:


Outside 3-D view:

[COOL TOM]

Shed

If i was you i would get a double car garage kit for your shed.
I have a single car garage 12 by 20 i can get 2 bikes in it easy but does not leave any room for working with all the other tools in there like air compresser, parts cleaning tank, tool box, parts bin, work bench, storage bin, and all the little stuff. I think by the time you got your lathe and all the stuff that goes with it (tools,steel,alum) and work bench, when you park your bike in there you are not going to have room to work with a 10 by 12 shed. As for the concrete floor go with 4 inch with wire reinforcement and have it delivered by truck. That will get you a even mixture all the way through with no dry or wet spots in it so that it will last longer. Have a couple of buddys help with the concrete and furnish the beer and maybe a quick lunch. Of course the beer comes AFTER the job is done. Like it has been said before check the building codes in your area.

Tom
82 XJ1100 DAILY RIDE
78 XS1100E FIXING UP
79 XS1100F PARTS BIKE
82 XJ1100 IN THE ROUGH

[mro]

My 2 penny nails worth

Most counties you don't need a permit for 200 square feet or less, but you should check.

Probably get away with an 8 inch footer on such a small building with 4 inch floor. Run #4 or 5 rebar in footer (suspended) attach bolts to rebar to hold wall. (can get bolts at a place like Home Depot) Would not hurt to place some rebar under any area where heavy equipment is going to be placed. Frame wall and drill bottom plate for bolts, set in place and tighten it down. Don't forget "dead wood" in framing.

Made a 6 X 17 foot shed in back yard, pretty much full with yard equip.. 10 X 12 could be a little cramped

Steak out the spot where you want shed (add string for walls), spread some news paper the size of known things your going to put in it. Will give you a almost full size idea of how space is used.


mro
btw
concrete it's self is not very strong, it's the steel and bed it lays on that gives it strength

[mro]

Oh........

Don't forget about drainage. It does rain in your neck of the woods?????

can also run electrical conduit in the concrete


mro

[gerkenbruce]

HI T.C.

You need a shop not a shed Bigger now Better lator.Ya got to have room to grow.

XSively
Bruce

[chevy45412001]

10x14

if you can go big or stay on the porch. i helped build a few sheds in my time and 10x14 is pretty small,a garden tractor and a few benches and your already working outside to have room.14x14 or larger if codes and funds allow. you will kick yourself with anything 10 foot.

[TopCatGr58]

ThanXS Xsively for all of your replies!

Just want to say thanXS for all of the info, and the time and trouble you've all gone thru to provide the info.

I went to the local municipal codes web site, but all I could find were the FEEs for building permits, $25.00 minimum for residential zero to 200 cu.ft. or so, $7.00 per each 100cu.ft. up to 1000, etc.. We don't get that hard of freezes here, so I don't think the frost depth or a footing is needed. When they built our house, we saw it being built, they just put 2 layers of cinder block onto the ground....slightly dug down about 6" below ground level, and then built the frame on top of that. So..I'm pretty sure that I would just need a solid slab laying on the ground, but not any extra deep footings!

However.....after discussing with SWMBO, she let me know that she really doesn't want or care about being able to drive the car into the garage. It's a nice 2 car garage, with a 14 or so foot celing, pegboard on both side walls, just a lot of junk after 10 years. So...after I clean it out, I may have much more room than I need, with the power and sturdy floor already there.

We may still put up a smaller SHED, but it will probably be JUST a storage shed, so it can be a bit smaller and $$cheaper, leaving more $$ for me to buy more toys....er, I mean tools, and stuff for Godzilla, as well as more raw materials so I can try to make more goodies for "US" Xsives and our bikes! I've learned alot already, and I'm sure I'll learn more as I continue this project, no matter how big or small it becomes!!
T.C.

[Czekus21]

Just remember, with more room, comes more junk. I just moved to a bigger house. At the old house, I had a 14x18 singe garage. Everything seemed to fit nice. At the new house I have a 20x30 garage for the cages, a 8x12 shed for the yard care stuff, and a 14x20 garage for the bike stuff and all my tools. I've got barely enough room to stuff MIYAMI in the shop let alone fit it in the big garage. Mabee after we're fully unpacked things will be more organized. If I were in your shoes, I would go for a wire reenforced slab at least 4" thick. Mabee go up to a 12x14. also would have at least a 12x10 slab in front of the door. It makes all the difference in the world.
If you do decide to only put up a shed, Look for a sale for a shed kit. I bought one a few years ago from Menards for under a grand. Including the floor. ( wood ) 8x12. I drew up plans for the same size shed but instead of 2x4 walls, went up to 2x6 and the floors from 2x6 to 2x8, floors from reg osb to 3/4" plywood. under 1500.00. If you want I can draw up a set of plans for you with a detailed list down to the last screw. Just pm me with how big you want and give me some time to get them drawn up.

[mro]

After another 10 years at the TC spread

"Honey, do you know which one I parked Godzilla in?"

[TopCatGr58]

Hey Steve,

Thanks for the offer for the plans. The 8x12 looks like the size I'll be going with, for lawnmower and other "JUNK" I can get out of the garage.

LOWES has these wooden framed kits, an 8x8x8 WITHOUT a floor for $650.00.

I have just spent a couple hours going thru making diagrams, figuring out what materials I'll need. Our house has Vinyl siding, but that's $$, I've found some stuff called Harditrim, 3/8" thick, 4x8 panels with 8" OC grooves running lengthwise. I'm thinking about turning them so the strips run horizontal to match the house, will be much cheaper than 7/16" OSB and then siding! I'll have to paint it, but it comes with a grey sealing coat already on it, won't rot, crack, resistant to termites.

Instead of CONCRETE, I'll be using pressure treated 4x4's and 2x4's for the base, and then some 23/32" OSB tongue/groove 4x8 boards to make a floor.

Aside from nails, including roofing materials, I've calculated it to about $650.00...+tax, and that INCLUDES the FLOOR!

So...looks like I'll get 4 extra feet of space for same price, and a floor!

And I've learned why they have those 92-5/8" studs as well as the 96" long ones!! Framing is FUN!
T.C.