How strong is a hand swaged aluminum cable stop?

[dbeardslee]

Speaking of short and simple... while this repair looks like a good one, I went ahead and ordered a new set of cables for the rear 'cause I don't think the cable with the long inner cable was correct for this vehicle. The equalizer has indentations in it that allow the stops to articulate a little bit, ostensibly so it can do it's equalizing thing. At least now I know exactly what to look for on the new cables so I won't have to put them on the vehicle to tell if they're right.

I got thinking about it, and decided if I was going to change the cables I should probably do it while everything in the rear brakes is clean and new. The bolt fix is working great now, but as the brakes wear in and the cables stretch it won't allow the equalizer to move like it should. But the bolt fix will definitely work until the new cables come in.

[3Phase]

Yep, shortandsimple!

[dbeardslee]

If you don't want to solder it, now would be a good time to try some of that wicked wicking Loctite green 290 for pre-assembled parts. It'll help keep the steel from rusting or the bolt and nut backing off.


I tried to look up the skydiver's prayer and they all seemed too artsy and long-winded for skydiving. I know I'd be chanting something totally simple-minded like Tuco: "You know what you are! You son of a AH-AH-AH-AH-AAHH!" until the 'chute opened and I was back on the ground.

The skydiver's prayer goes like this - "Oh God, please don't let me f@&* this up!"

[3Phase]

If you don't want to solder it, now would be a good time to try some of that wicked wicking Loctite green 290 for pre-assembled parts. It'll help keep the steel from rusting or the bolt and nut backing off.


I tried to look up the skydiver's prayer and they all seemed too artsy and long-winded for skydiving. I know I'd be chanting something totally simple-minded like Tuco: "You know what you are! You son of a AH-AH-AH-AH-AAHH!" until the 'chute opened and I was back on the ground.

[dbeardslee]

Well the deed is done, and the bolt fix seems to have worked swimmingly. Good call 3Phase. It was a real PITA, though. The biggest bolt I could use was a 5/16ths, and the cable turned out to be real close to 5/32nds which is the size of the hole I drilled in the bolt. So naturally I ham-fisted the first one and snapped the bolt.

On the second try rather than using two washers I just used one that was slightly larger than the bolt, and that allowed me to put a pretty good kink in the cable which I don't think is going to let go. The hardest part was trying to get that second bolt over the cable after I got it all frayed on the end. I didn't think it was going to go, so I did what I always do in these kind of situations - I said the skydiver's prayer. And less than two minutes later I had it on the cable. The skydiver's prayer - the handyman's real secret weapon.

[dbeardslee]

Better to get a cable with the Yamaha name on it and pay 3 times as much.

Well, the cable is on an XJ - unfortunately it's a Jeep XJ, so I'm thinkin' Yamaha probably isn't the best place to go for a cable. But if push comes to shove a new cable is in my future. The good news is the stop can fail and the only thing that will happen is that I loose half my parking brake.

[ViperRon]

Depending on the composition of the metal on the stop it may be different. The aluminum may be a mix of metal maybe have a tin content. Typically aluminum looses strength any time it is deformed and it is much less malleable than other metals. So if a stop is crimped on, aluminum is a bad choice.
Heat from soldering it has an effect on the strength of the cable strands and can make the cable much less flexible.

The only time I have been lucky enough to put a new stop end on a motor cycle cable and have it hold was using an oxy/ acetylene and a quick touch of silver solder on the end.

Usually the stops slide right off can't hold up to the strain. If the cable gets hot from heat and does any bending it will break.

My experience is if you want to crimp better have the right crimps and right crimper for that cable or it will leave you sitting.

You can buy replacement steel cable stops with a lock screw that pins the cable inside the stop. If the right size tight on cable and has an Allen head you can get tight they work well.

There are many cable makers selling cables but for our bikes some of these cables are not capable of handling the clutch I have had new ones stretch ends come off and especially the ones with internal plastic the cable mar it and it ball up and bind the cable. Better to get a cable with the Yamaha name on it and pay 3 times as much.

Cars and Lawn mowers much different experience have had much success with those cables.

[dbeardslee]

Okay, important safety tip: Do not rock crawl your Jeep to the top of Upper Yosemite Falls to test the new emergency brake cable end to see if it holds but for almost anything short of hanging it from a tree and winching it up the trunk to make a tree fort out of it you should be fine.

I just realized something... whatever the force that's applied to the brake lever cable it's halved for the rear cables since there's two of them. I'll try the bolt and washers and see what I get. That way if I don't like what I see I can take it back off and do the swage and solder thing.

[3Phase]

I'm going to give the bolt thing a try tomorrow. Seems like it would get the best bite on the cable of my available options. I'm a little limited in space, and the bolt I've got picked out is like a 7 or 8mm - a little bigger than 1/4". The cable is 3/32nds, and will probably require an 1/8" hole. I'm wondering if there will still be enough of the bolt left where the hole is to be strong enough to put some torque on it. One way to find out...

Okay, important safety tip: Do not rock crawl your Jeep to the top of Upper Yosemite Falls to test the new emergency brake cable end to see if it holds but for almost anything short of hanging it from a tree and winching it up the trunk to make a tree fort out of it you should be fine.

[dbeardslee]

Nah! Vice grips, my good man! Vice grips! You run the cable through the EQ, then grasp it ever so gently with your finest set of needle-nose vice grips so it can't pull back.

Thread the cable through the hole in the bolt, clamp it between the washers, then trim the sharp ends with a precision angle grinder and solder it to keep it safe. Acid core plumbers solder works great for sealing steel cables squished between steel washers and steel bolts so they don't rust too, it's not just for sweating copper pipes.

And yes you can solder the cable to make a cable/solder plug for the aluminum cable stop. You'd have to drill through the stop, then push the cable through the hole and solder the strands so they can't pull back through.

I'm going to give the bolt thing a try tomorrow. Seems like it would get the best bite on the cable of my available options. I'm a little limited in space, and the bolt I've got picked out is like a 7 or 8mm - a little bigger than 1/4". The cable is 3/32nds, and will probably require an 1/8" hole. I'm wondering if there will still be enough of the bolt left where the hole is to be strong enough to put some torque on it. One way to find out...

[3Phase]

I'm going to keep this one in mind - JIC. I could do it this way, but I'd have to have the equalizer on the cable before I put the bolt in place. Sounds vaguely like one of those jobs that require three hands.

Nah! Vice grips, my good man! Vice grips! You run the cable through the EQ, then grasp it ever so gently with your finest set of needle-nose vice grips so it can't pull back.

Thread the cable through the hole in the bolt, clamp it between the washers, then trim the sharp ends with a precision angle grinder and solder it to keep it safe. Acid core plumbers solder works great for sealing steel cables squished between steel washers and steel bolts so they don't rust too, it's not just for sweating copper pipes.

And yes you can solder the cable to make a cable/solder plug for the aluminum cable stop. You'd have to drill through the stop, then push the cable through the hole and solder the strands so they can't pull back through.

[dbeardslee]

Or drill a hole in a bolt to put the cable through and cinch it down between a couple of washers.

I'm going to keep this one in mind - JIC. I could do it this way, but I'd have to have the equalizer on the cable before I put the bolt in place. Sounds vaguely like one of those jobs that require three hands.

[dbeardslee]

If it's clean and dry you can solder darn near anything to anything. Well, except plastic but that'll work too if you melt it just right.

The important part is the clean and the dry and if you don't have any 50/50 solder with a bottle of acid flux, get one of those micro aluminum welding kits with the torch, flux and wire/rod.


Or drill a hole in a bolt to put the cable through and cinch it down between a couple of washers. It's not going to need to support the weight of the Jeep, just set and hold the brake, right? Snip and solder-seal the steel ends so you don't hurt yourself later and go find something else to do like ride your motorcycle.

After Rasputin's post, I think I'm getting a mental handle on it. You're actually soldering the wires of the cable together and creating a plug that won't fit through the hole in the stop. Kind of a stop for the stop kind of deal. Right?

[3Phase]

If it's clean and dry you can solder darn near anything to anything. Well, except plastic but that'll work too if you melt it just right.

The important part is the clean and the dry and if you don't have any 50/50 solder with a bottle of acid flux, get one of those micro aluminum welding kits with the torch, flux and wire/rod.


Or drill a hole in a bolt to put the cable through and cinch it down between a couple of washers. It's not going to need to support the weight of the Jeep, just set and hold the brake, right? Snip and solder-seal the steel ends so you don't hurt yourself later and go find something else to do like ride your motorcycle.

[dbeardslee]

You have to unwind the cable ends as best you can, then bend them over about 90 degrees or more and then pour the solder or babbit into the space you have. I have pulled thousands of pounds in the oilfield doing that exact thing.

I'm not sure I'm following you. If I'm hearing you right, you've got the stop swaged onto the cable, with some excess cable past the stop. Unwind and bend those cables out, and apply the solder to the center of the cable? Kind of creating a door-stop effect. Course the next problem is that the cable is on the vehicle, and I don't really want to completely disassemble the brake again to get the cable loose. It would be pretty tough to solder it where it is.

What are your thoughts on crimping multiple stops on the cable? It doesn't have to withstand thousands of pounds. Probably more like 100-200 pounds (not sure what kind of mechanical advantage I get at the brake handle, but I seriously doubt it's more than 200 pounds on the cable.)